First Gay Parade in Indonesia. Now, do you think you will ever see this in Malaysia? I wonder what is Pakatan Rakyat’s stand on this. I am sure there will be a million conflicting views.

May 17 was International Day Against Homophobia. Our Indonesia sisters and brothers took to the streets in Jakarta to say No against homophobia, lesbophobia and tranphobia, as these prejudices can be so thick that those holding them become irrational towards the gay community.

Are you homophobic, lesbophobic or transphobic? Go on reading.

Gay rights are human rights. If you believe in freedom of religion and belief, if you believe in human rights, you would allow them their place on earth.


In Indonesia, the Ardhanary Institute (Women LBT Reserch, Publishes and Advocacy Centre) and the Indonesian Coalition of Women LGBT Rights are formost in raising this controversial issue at the national and international level.

It would be interesting to see the day when even men come out in support of gay women rights in Malaysia.

* Images sent to me by friends in Indonesia.

65 responses »

  1. hutchrun says:

    “In a very few years, perhaps in a very few months, we shall be confronted with demands with which we shall no doubt be invited to comply. Those demands may affect the surrender of territory or the surrender of liberty. I foresee and foretell that the policy of submission will carry with it restrictions upon the freedom of speech and debate in Parliament, on public platforms, and discussions in the press, for it will be said–indeed, I hear it said sometimes now – that we cannot allow the Nazi system of dictatorship to be criticized by ordinary, common English politicians. Then, with a press under control, in part direct but more potently indirect, with every organ of public opinion doped and chloroformed into acquiescence, we shall be conducted along further stages of our journey.”

    — Winston Churchill

  2. Harrison says:

    ahahahahahhahahahahahah. Arghhhhhhh Hahahahhahahahahah. Sorry to ask, did you enjoy the event ,Susan?

  3. lucia says:

    i am homospaien.🙂

    yeah, i support the rights of gays and lesbians!

  4. hutchrun says:

    They are lucky they are not in Gambia or Iran:

    He promised “stricter laws than Iran” on homosexuality and said he would “cut off the head” of any gay person found in The Gambia.

    http://islamoscope.wordpress.com/2008/05/25/gambia-to-behead-homosexuals/

  5. hutchrun says:

    “In Iran we don’t have homosexuals like in your country. We don’t have that like in your country. … In Iran we do not have this phenomenon. I don’t know who’s told you that we have this”. – President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad

    http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/25/world/middleeast/25iran.html?hp

  6. hutchrun says:

    “In Iran we don’t have homosexuals like in your country. We don’t have that like in your country. … In Iran we do not have this phenomenon. I don’t know who’s told you that we have this”. – President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad

    nytimes.com/2007/09/25/world/middleeast/25iran.html?hp

  7. Robert Teh says:

    Homosexuals, lesbians, metrosexuals, bisexuals, transvestites, transexuals, double-dressers, gays, queens or queers – they are all humans (like us) and they too have rights (like us).

    If they want to celebrate their sexuality and it does not offend your public mores, why not?

    I will object if their public expression of their sexuality is offensive, crude or vulgar – otherwise, I think they will make our world more colorful.

  8. Harrison says:

    Sorry, I forgotten to read the articles. It was held in Indonesia. No, I ain’t a gay,pondan hater. but not until they are “poaching” me.

    The last time a bisexual, I mistaken as a straight man treated me so special, I was wondering of his motive…. Then, when the crowd seems to be a distance from us, he told me that he was a bisexual and I told him that I am a straight man. He even went further to offer me to mouthed my “didi” for RM50 a pop.

    I didn’t talk to him at least for 1 week since that incidemt. Oh yes, we are ex-colleague.

  9. 729 NO ISA! says:

    You all dont bluffing here. There is no religion in this world which allow lesbian/gay. So keep following the nature that we dont need gay/lesbian in Malaysia.

  10. hutchrun says:

    The Boy Scouts of America’s Philadelphia chapter has sued the City of Philadelphia in federal court to block the city’s May 31 deadline for the scouts to open membership to gays and atheists, or vacate their historic 1928 headquarters off Logan Square. The civil rights lawsuit, filed Friday in federal court in Center City, contends that the city’s ultimatum violates the scouts’ rights under the U.S. and Pennsylvania Constitutions.

    http://www.stoptheaclu.com/archives/2008/05/27/boyscouts-sue-philly-to-stay-in-hq/

  11. hutchrun says:

    The Ottoman Turks were infamous for inflicting it throughout the Great War on captured enemy troops, beating and gang raping enemy officers often as a matter of due course. Prisons and garrisons often had personnel who specialized in this abuse, although there was nothing homosexual about it.

    The Turkish soldiers perpetrating this war crime certainly never considered themselves gay, like male rapists in prison the act has nothing to do with the sexual orientation of the attacker or victim. “It’s not about sexual gratification, rather a sexual aggressor using somebody else as a means of expressing their own power and control”.

    It was a remarkable manifestation of courage, perhaps cathartic release, that Lawrence detailed what happened to him in his book Seven Pillars of Wisdom in 1926. Then as now the fear of being labelled homosexual as a result of such disclosure was a legitimate fear, society having the tendency of blaming the victim of sexual assault rather than the perpetrator.

    If the 28 year old Lawrence was a virgin at the time of his assault, as many biographers believe, the experience would have had a profoundly negative affect on his concept of self and sexuality. Alas in his lifetime there were no counselling services available to men who had suffered sexual assault, they were expected to get on with their lives with a stiff upper lip.

    The post traumatic effects of same sex rape often last a lifetime, T.E. Lawrence manifested all the classic symptoms: workaholism, “depression, anger, increased sense of vulnerability, destructive self image, emotional distancing”

    – Silent Victims: Bringing Male Rape Out of the Closet, by Sue Brochman (1991)

  12. Umar Rentaka says:

    I disagree. Same gender sex is wrong. They need education and counseling so that they can give up their activities.

  13. hutchrun says:

    ALMOST all her life “Jess” has felt like a boy trapped in a girl’s body. From the age of six, shopping trips usually ended in the boy’s clothing section.
    Now 12, she recently told a psychiatrist her long-held dream was to overcome biology and one day live as a man – complete with wife and children.

    The thought of growing breasts and starting her periods provoked such anxiety in Jess that her mother successfully sought a court order allowing her daughter to start a sex change.

    Under court orders, the girl will receive taxpayer-funded hormone implants every three months to suppress puberty.

    The prospect of testosterone treatment and surgery in coming years was flagged in court.

    Her parents, who are separated, are deeply divided over the proposed sex swap.

    http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,23753966-1243,00.html

  14. xy says:

    From the perspective of Chinese “Yin-Yang” concept, homosexuals are not particularly unusual.

    For in anything that we see, there is always an element of Yang within Yin and vice-versa.

    Therefore we see some shades of manhood in women and some shades of womanhood in men.

    It is all about the extent of that complimentary component.

    To be more abstract mathematically :
    (X+Y)^3 =XXX + XXY + XYX+YXX+XYY+YXY+YYX+ YYY.

    So between the clearer XXX and YYY, there are many shades of combination between X and Y. (say X=Yang, Y=Yin).

    So lets not predudice against our brothers and sisters. It is just their make-up of their beings, from birth.

    What a normal society with pure XXX and YYY are man-made concepts. In natural universe, more usual than not, we find shades of X & Y mixed together in a single being.

    Leave them alone.

  15. will win says:

    God created Adam & Eve – man & woman. anything else is abnormal!

    i don’t despise them, but i sure hope they can come back to the right path.

  16. wits0 says:

    729 NO ISA! : “There is no religion in this world which allow lesbian/gay.”

    Religion is made for man and not man is made for religion. Specifically, in fact, you’re also wrong because you are only alluding to authoritarian (monotheistic)religions and their known obsession with mass control and theocratic power.

    One may be uneasy and leery about homosexuals but until they pose a real threat like fundamental religious fanatics, they too have a right to free and open expression on their queer private taste.

  17. kittykat46 says:

    Look on the bright side, they are helping to reduce the population growth.
    1+1 = 0…LOL..

  18. wits0 says:

    The likely rationale behind some religions animosity towards sexual deviation is clearly related to the very tribal instinct which these religion were rooted in.

    1+1 = 0 is bad for the tribe which will then lose strength.

  19. su says:

    As is obvious from the different views of a mere 18 comments (at the time I was typing this), Same-sex relationships don’t go down well with most Malaysians.

    Contrary to what most believe, gay people don’t choose to be gay. Most gays were born that way. How else can you explain a 5-year-old boy wanting to wear a dress, and a 6-year-old girl just refusing to wear skirts? They are children, and they have peers, and still they insist on doing what their peers don’t do. Children don’t “know” what adults do, assuming adults know more, children just do what they want to. They follow their hearts. Is it fair to say that they have “chosen” to be gay?

    When this tendency towards same-sex is something in-born, no amount of counselling is going to do shit.

    I don’t know about public displays and parades for gay and lesbian pride. For me, I think it’s something personal. It’s something private. Not because it’s something to be ashamed of. But we don’t see people taking the streets to declare that they sleep around, now do we?

    Religions don’t “allow” same-sex relationships. True. But a friend of mine (female) said this to me, and mind you, she’s quite a Buddhist.
    If I am not allowed to love another woman, then why have I been made this way?

  20. Aji says:

    I think the number of women in Malaysia is enough, fit for every man to have a “double”. So, why go through the side or back door when one can be assured a safe entry from the front.

  21. xy says:

    There is no absolute rights, and no absolute wrongs.

    I leave Laozi’s wisdom for your reference :
    “知不知, 上 ; 不知知, 病”.

    For the Universe has no special preference for us fellow human beings or any other beings. They are all the same. The difference is only our heart and mind.

    And to cling to specific ideas is the source of pain and conflicts.
    For it is said in The Diamond Sutra :”..应无所住而生其心”.

    I wish you all well and BTW, I am straight.

    Namo Amitabha.

  22. Why did God made man and woman ?

  23. nadzrikamsin says:

    What is your stand? Do you support gay & lesbian?

  24. crower says:

    Same gender sex is WRONG…..’nuff said

  25. crower says:

    If PKR wants to lose the majority of its Malay supporters, they will support such a move.

  26. xy says:

    nadzrikamsin,

    they have a right to live the way according to their physiological and mental needs, never-mind whether it matches our value system.

    My value system is that the Universe doesn’t favour anything/anyone.
    We choose our own value systems, be it islam, christianity, buddhism etc.
    and that’s good enough.

    I have christian friends who told me in the recent tragic earthquake in sichuan that one christian family was totally saved while all their neighours perished. i have problem with this type of mentality. I am not christian, I read bible once in a while and see what wisdom i can learn and i respect their faith.

    Religion is always going to be a touchy issue for we human beings by large is still ill-equipped to handle our emotion when discussing it.

    Sorry for bringing up this issue, just to make sure all understand where i am coming from and i hv no interest at all to engage in a debate on religion, here in this blog or elsewhere.

  27. gooeyglobs says:

    They are fine with me. They did not ask to be born in that way! Give them their self-respect. What’s so difficilt about that? What if their “community” is more that those unlike them, then those unlike them will be in the shoes as what they are in now? They have their civil and human rights. No prejudice on my part.

  28. hutchrun says:

    Munirah Bahari, the vice president of the National Islamic Students Association of Malaysia, didn’t agree with that sort of transparency because she thought there was too much of it in schools already.

    She firmly believed that schoolgirls wore alluring outfi ts that “were a distraction to men” which, if left unchecked “could lead to babies born out of wedlock and, to an extent, even prostitution”.

    It was staggering logic that floored Marina Mahathir but Ms Munirah knew that Malaysian men were a serial-raping, handbag snatching bunch of miscreants who vacillated between the English Premier League and ‘keris’- waving in fits and starts, which only proved that they had to be protected from themselves and their penchant for hanging around schools to ogle children.

    Ibrahim sympathised and thought that the answer lay in teaching women to appreciate the pleasures of polygamy. He was a selftaught, well-read man who rued the fact that his library had recently burned down, which meant that he’d lost both books, one of which he hadn’t fi nished colouring.

    http://www.malaysia-today.net/2008/content/view/8079/35/

  29. wits0 says:

    “Do you support gay & lesbian?” – nadzrikamsin

    Really, what business is it of anyone else? Could you suggest the Iranian/Hitler’s final solution?

  30. wits0 says:

    Munirah Bahari chosed to be a masochist in order to feel ‘accepted”. But what right has she to suggest others follow suit?

  31. Noor Aza Othman says:

    At least Indonesia allows such protest! Imagine if it’s done here! Our fellow sisters and brothers of lesbians and gays will be in the slammer by five minutes! After being bashed by baton-& barbarism-loving FRU and the police force! Also, that Munirah idiot from the Islamic Students Group might come out with another “Islamic” declaration – “gays and lesbians” are causing uprising of sexual crime and prostitution, and seducing men and women with lustful behaviour!!

    Noor Aza Othman.

  32. xy says:

    I believe many of you study biology.

    Sexual behaviours are largely influenced by hormones. And control and balance of hormonal system throughout one’s lifetime is a very complicated stuff. It has alot to do with genetics and impairment to the hormonal system.

    Say someone is born with genetical problem that leads to say a higher probability of breast cancer, is she to be blamed?

  33. DR.Aditya says:

    I believe these lesbians & gays has no morals nor religion. As they say “tak kisah” what colour,religion you are as long as you agree to have Unatural & sex against order of nature.

    These are the signs of world going to end.If i were given powers to control world.First thing i will issue shoot at sight orders for GAYS & Lesbians.As animals also follow law & order of nature unlike these Mentally sick people.

    These are excuses of unbalance harmones etc.Mind can be control by counselling & practising Just like animals can be trained to be tamed & live with Humans.

    Get my message the Gays & lesbians you people are worst then animals.

  34. Noor Aza Othman says:

    “DR” Aditya,

    YOU SHOULD BE LOCKED UP IN A MENTAL INSTITUTION FOR BEING A SOCIOPATH, WHO’S IRRATIONAL HATRED OF FELLOW HUMAN BEINGS (FOR JUST BEING DIFFERENT IN SEXUAL OUTLOOK), ARE UNNATURAL AND AGAINST HUMANITY! SO GROW UP; BECAUSE YOU YOURSELF AND SOCIOPATH RANTINGS SHOWS YOU’RE WORST THAN BEASTS! I WONDER IF YOU’VE ANY RELIGION SINCE I THOUGHT ALL RELIGION TEACH COMPASSION, KINDNESS AND HUMANITY TO FELLOW HUMAN BEINGS (WHO HAVE NOT COMMITTED ANY INJUSTICE TO YOU OF COURSE).

    NOOR AZA OTHMAN.

  35. xy says:

    “I believe these lesbians & gays has no morals nor religion…” Dr. Aditya.

    That’s very strong words coming from somebody with a title Dr.

    There are also many ‘straights” who have no morals or religion.

    I believe in karma, careful you might just ended up on the other camp in your next life.

    Your strong distaste of someone who do not share the same values as you is very bothering in a multi-racial society with different belief-systems.

    If one can’t tolerate a small minority of same-sex sexual orientation, how can one tolerate a much bigger group of people differing from your belief-system?

    This topic is very revealing indeed, on the deeper psychology of the people. Harmonius society? Guess it will not happen in our life-time.

    Namo Amitabha.

  36. ironic_law says:

    Gays, Lesbian, Queer and Transvestites, Sigh! No matter how we hated, antagonized, scolded, jerked, shouted at them (No we resorted to use VIOLENCE to solve this ISSUE).. They will still exist and they are HOMOSAPIENS like us as well so they should get their RIGHTS TO LIVE the LIFE that they wanted but live well for now AS I’m not sure in HEAVEN or HELL you will be in your AFTERLIFE as most RELIGIONS are ANTI Gay and Lesbians. So please be reminded about this when you decided to choose the SEXUAL ORIENTATION or GENDER of your choice, hope you all will not REGRET it. MAY GOD HAD MERCY ON YOU…. FAREWELL

  37. wits0 says:

    Dr. Aditya proves that bigotry and intolerance transcends social standing of a person. It’s from this sort of self-righteous mindset and that egoistic seeking of peer approval that such a reaction comes. Exactly why any belief system based rigidly on dogmas has that pull towards inhumanity as a means by itself.

  38. oster says:

    @wits0,

    Your view on religion as an instrument of mass control is far too simplistic and a big generalisation. Furthermore, not all religions may explicitly condemn homosexuality.

    @people who say homosexuality is “wrong”,

    “Right” and “wrong” is subjective. Laws are usually promulgated to prevent “wrongs” that a majority of the population agrees upon, hence the banning of homosexuality in Malaysia.

    HOWEVER, it must be noted that consensual homosexuality is a victimless crime, and hence does not infringe upon the rights of any other citizens. So why make it illegal? Does the state have a place in the bedroom?

    @people who advocate legal action on homosexuals,

    In legal cases, the intent, or motive of a perpetrator is always scrutinised. Insanity, for example, can be used as reasoning as to the lack of clear intent on the part of an offender.

    For homosexuals then, one must ask, “are homosexuals attracted to the same gender BY CHOICE?”

    The answer is “we don’t know”. Science has not gone that far yet.

    In effect, sexual orientation may be biologically beyond our control. Should something beyond our control cause us to be punished? Should, for example, a person afflicted with Tourette’s syndrome be chastised for making noise in class, when he didn’t purposefully try to get the disease?

    I’m a straight dude currently in the UK, and I can say the co-existence of gays in close proximity has never caused me any harm, hence, why should I advocate unleashing the arm of the law against these individuals?

    cheers

  39. wits0 says:

    “not all religions may explicitly condemn homosexuality.”
    Read again, oster, that’s exactly what I meant. That which are so cocksure about their own “moral” outlook to take it upon themselves to persecute others to the extent of shooting detractors on the grounds of sexuality have lost their own raison d’être to claim to be moral. Once you lost your humanity, such a claim is utter nonsense.

  40. xy says:

    hundreds of thousands of poor people have perished in Myanmar and Sichuan and milions more displaced.

    To be alive is gracious and may I suggest for those who are so strongly against the people with different sexual orientation (which frankly in the larger scale of things in the Universe would seem trivial) than yours please channel your energy into good cause in helping the destitutes.

    Namo amitabha.

  41. u-jean says:

    if people can accept you for who you are, there is no reason why you can’t do the same for others. why are people so focused on differences rather than see what they each other have in common? why can people look past race and religion but not look past sexual orientation?

    “These are the signs of world going to end.If i were given powers to control world.First thing i will issue shoot at sight orders for GAYS & Lesbians.As animals also follow law & order of nature unlike these Mentally sick people.”

    People like you are no better than Nazis. If all couples produce 8 children, then the world will really end from overpopulation.

  42. u-jean says:

    “Gay rights are human rights. If you believe in freedom of religion and belief, if you believe in human rights, you would allow them their place on earth.”

    It was never your place to allow in the first place and it’s has never been your place to deny

  43. hutchrun says:

    “These are the signs of world going to end.If i were given powers to control world.First thing i will issue shoot at sight orders for GAYS & Lesbians.As animals also follow law & order of nature unlike these Mentally sick people.”

    Now that sounds like one of those mental sickos. Lucky that`s not the AG or PM who tho` immensely detestable still are a 100 times better.

  44. xy says:

    it is not constructive to give a religious spin on this topic.

    a large number of us are still ill-equipped emotionally when religion is brought into the equation. it divides us more than it unites.

    Namo Amitabha.

  45. Brothers-In-Arms says:

    Germany has erected a monument to homosexuals oppressed by the Nazis. It consists of a concrete box, with a little window where you can peek in like a pervert at a peepshow and see pictures of homosexuals smooching.

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080527/wl_nm/germany_homosexuals_monument_dc_3

  46. wits0 says:

    XY, tour choice of the word, “religious spin” is incorrect. A spin is something of a deliberate half truth or making up a story. When it’s a fact, it cannot be a spin at the same time. The DL himself has made gross political correct statement before and got castigated for it too.

    Won’t you agree than Man has to take responsibility for his own conduct/action ultimately, regardless of his inculcated ethos? If he proposes a bad idea, shouldn’t he be criticized?

  47. hutchrun says:

    BERLIN (Reuters) – Germany unveiled a monument to the tens of thousands of homosexuals persecuted under the Nazis, whose laws were used to prosecute gay men for a generation after World War Two.

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080527/wl_nm/germany_homosexuals_monument_dc_3

  48. xy says:

    wits0,

    correction accepted.

    what i intended to mean is that it isn’t constructive to bring in the discussion of religion into this topic.

    Have a good day.

  49. hutchrun says:

    Tue May 27

    BERLIN (Reuters) – Germany unveiled a monument to the tens of thousands of homosexuals persecuted under the Nazis, whose laws were used to prosecute gay men for a generation after World War Two.

    news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080527/wl_nm/germany_homosexuals_monument_dc_3

  50. kazam says:

    hmm nancy guna lah your ten fingers god given…hahaha

  51. kazam says:

    lesbian should be allowed pupus sendiri… jangan bagi sperm kat dia..aniaya anak yang akan lahir saje..

  52. xy says:

    “hmm nancy guna lah your ten……………..”

    “lesbian should be allowed pupus sendiri… jangan ………………..”

    shocking comments. please respect Susan’s blog as well as yourself.

  53. oster says:

    @wits0

    Indeed, it is the sentient beings who are confident in their subjective conception of morality that are overbearing, and not necessarily the religion itself. Ponder on how a branch of the Episcopalian church now has gay clergy, based on the premise that the Christian message of love among humans outweighs any condemnation of people with different sexual orientation.

    @xy

    It is very useful to bring up religion here. Many who object to different sexual orientations derive their opposition from their interpretation of religion. Thus, it is quite constructive to illustrate how hate can be contrary to the same religion’s teachings as well.

    cheers

  54. xy says:

    oster,

    In principle I agree with you, though in reality, even before meaning discussion can begin, religious inclination clouds many from seeing clearly the underlying issue and the need for tolerance. Just look at the remark on “killing them off”?

    There are just hatreds, hatreds and more hatreds. If their minds are so full of hatreds, how much space left for them to fill in some for compassion?

  55. freewave says:

    It is weird and psychologically wrong. I bet some are not driven by hormone, curious perhaps. I personally think same gender sexual activities are not healthy, not really have a phobia towards these people but I think it is wrong and against nature.

    Some even supportive of zoophiles, because they argue that if there is no cruelty to animal, it is not unethical.

  56. xy says:

    freewave,

    maybe I was mistaken, thought the focus here is on same-sex relationship rather than same gender sexual activities.

    One can argue that same-sex relationship would involve sexual activity. That said, their relationships should go way beyond that. Isn’t that the case with relationships between opposite sex? Surely one does get into a relationship purely as sex partner. If this is the case, then heterosexual relationship is just as unhealthy.

    Hope this clarifies.

  57. xy says:

    freewave,

    you brought up a very interesting angle.

    when we see a couple of opposite sex in love, we see all the good things.

    it appears that quite many, when seeing a couple of same-sex in love, the first thing that prop up in their minds is sexual activities.

    i guess maybe we should ask ourselves why this bias? and who really need counselling.

  58. oster says:

    freewave,

    “Right” and “Wrong” is subjective. “Natural” is as well. Who defines what is natural, and what yardstick (more accurately, who’s yardstick) do we use?

    What scientific knowledge do we have about sexual orientation? From what we can surmise at this point, whether it’s by choice, or whether homosexuality is rooted in biologically process beyond the conscious control of human beings is unknown.

    cheers

  59. toplist says:

    You all dont bluffing here. There is no religion in this world which allow lesbian/gay. So keep following the nature that we dont need gay/lesbian in Malaysia.

  60. hutchrun says:

    toplist, you sound pretty gay this morning🙂

  61. Bola Hangus says:

    gays should stop spreading AIDS to the rest of us and die somewhere else. AIDs is brought to gays as punishment and now passed on to the rest of us for tolerating these scums.

  62. truth says:

    well, there are probably many more times bisexuals who are transferring AIDS and all sorts of STDs. don’t think we can just point the fingers at gays alone.

  63. Lainie says:

    i’m glad i saw this post🙂 looks fun!

  64. pitt says:

    adam and eve…not adam and adam or eve and eve….this is the rules…a God rules…can u thinks bout that…after u dies…where shud u be…in hell??

  65. Layra says:

    I wanna Join too!! Next year?? May 17th right??🙂

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s