(pix: Malaysiakini)

@ 7.18pm update: Police has denied he is detained under the ISA. It was a rumour probably started by “irresponsible” people, said Deputy IGP Tan Sri Ismail Omar (Bernama).

Early this morning, I read over at Jed Yoong’s and Rocky Bru’s that Zulkifli Noordin was detained by police. According to sms-es that’s been going around, Zul is probably detained for his involvement in the protest against the Bar Council’s forum on “Conversion to Islam”.

Jed thinks that maybe the Penal Code or Police Act may probably have a more suitable charge for someone who “disrupted public order”. Look at Mahaguru58’s blog to see photos and video clips on the protest.

@ 4.32am, I said that I do not know how much this is true, or whether the cops have gone visiting the Bar Council organisers as well.

Anyway, Zulkifli is the PKR/Kulim-Bandar Bahru MP who wants the Bar Council to be led by a Muslim. Read his blog. He also warned others not to challenge the Muslims as their patience was limited.

Oh, I really forgot to add. That this is the kind of reaction the government/BN/UMNO wants to see to justify their place in power.

With a smirk, they’ll say that we are not ready for multi-racial and multi-religious politics.

Look how the Home Minister is already using threats of “face the consequences” on the forum organisers – the Bar Council.

So, don’t give them a chance to take us back another 50 years, lah!

Yesterday, under my posting : Conversion to democracy first, then Islam…I said:

Okay. It’s easy to condemn the party that looks agressive. But Malaysians need to be converted to ideas of democracy first before we can even speak to them about something as controversial (to some) as “Conversion to Islam” or rather “Opting out of Islam”.

Much as we might detest their move, we need to allow the group of 300-odd Muslim protestors to have their say. We do, after all, respect their freedom of speech. And that means, accepting, though very painfully, those hurtful name callings such as “Babi (pig)…pengkhianat (traitor) and balik China (go home to China)”.

Yes, the protestors hurled all those labels at the organisers/ participants of the controversial forum.

But they forget that the organisers/participants were made up of Muslims, too. This is NOT the case of Muslims vs Non-Muslims.

Honestly, these labels do not surprise me nor pinch me in the least. Because I know they do not represent the views of many Malays and Muslims breathing in our land, especially my wonderful friends out there (you know who you are!).

About going home to China…please-lah, there are more Muslim Chinese in China, than they are Malaysian Muslims in Malaysia, I think. I laugh to think of this archaic notion, which I hope, is only held by a small sector of the protestors. And honestly, even people like me do not like to go to China. What for?

But if this is the overall mindset in which they judge all non-Muslims, then that is another matter for another day. We can see clearly how the government’s effort in nation building had failed in this department.

I am not a big fan of the Bar Council leadership, either,but I guess they are quite bold for wanting to go through this forum, for whatever it is worth, within the four walls of their headquarters in Kuala Lumpur today.

However, their courage was short lived. They had to wrap up the event (after one hour) due to police advice and the cries of angry protestors at their door steps.

Why didn’t the police allow the forum to continue and deal with the protestors outside, as they would have, if it involved Opposition supporters, for example, or demonstrations against the government?

Double standard at work? We are not surprised.

Among the protestors are PKR (Anwar Ibrahim’s party) and PAS members like its Youth chief Sallehuddin Ayub. It would be interesting to see how both parties supreme councils deal with this matter.

Is Anwar Ibrahim going to deal with this at all?

For example, PKR Kulim-Bandar Baharu, Zulkifli Noordin, the lawyer who opted out of the Altantuya case, was present too, and said he was not representing his party, but some Muslim lawyers assosiation.

No matter what you say Zul, you’ve come across as a Muslim hardliner, and hardly an advantage to the PKR, which is supposed to be multi-racial and multi-religious.

So, we all learn a lesson that Muslims (these 300-odd protestors, anyway) are not prepared to dialogue about conversion to Islam, as the attempt by Bar Council to provide a platform for the issue is regarded as challenging the sensitivities of the religion itself.

Where they get this notion is questionable. If we trace the source, perhaps we can understand why they are ranting like this?

But can we safely say that “Muslims cannot dialogue” without knowing whether the Bar Council members who organised this event had made any attempts to discuss their plan with Muslim representatives. Haven’t they learnt from the Article 11 experience in Penang in 2006?

Is it possible to have a closed door meetings with these group of people first before going so publicly to talk about conversion or opting out of Islam? I am not sure.

Because, it’s true that this is a sensitive matter to these Muslims and pushing the boundaries without showing respect (though respect may be involved) nor acknowledging their sensitivities (though this may not have been visible to others) is also something that needs to be looked into.

We need to convince our Muslim brothers and sisters (or rather the people who claim to represent them) that this dialogue is a much needed one, a significant landmark in the exercise of freedom of religion and belief, and that, it is not, and never going to be, one that is Islam bashing.

But what does the forum want to achieve in the end? We may never know now.

Too bad, but we are simply not there yet, to be able to put issues of religion and race on the table and discuss things openly, with a free for all attitude.

We have a long way to go. We’ve been divided long enough. This is merely a symptom, nay, a disease of years and years of delusion (that we have religious freedoms) and rule by division (based on ethnicity and religion).

But we’re getting there, believe me, if we try hard enough to be inclusive than exclusive.

And when that day comes, I am sure going to be glad that I am Malaysian.

261 responses »

  1. Towering Malay says:

    Haha this one for that strike gold chap-to-kam. Quick go chap chap change name.

  2. PureMalaysian says:

    I can be sure that even after PR takes over the govt (if there is a chance anyway) the issue of Malay supremacy, Islam as national religion and NEP etc. will continue on, just like before. Nothing will change. It is just a great hoo-haa for the nation to topple BN govt and change to another same mind-set people.

  3. CJC says:

    Agreed. I’ve met nice Malays (rather Muslims) but it’s always the Constitution when the the Malay/Islam issue comes up. Never the Constitution when they say anything they like without regards for anyone.

  4. karl says:

    times like these make me ashamed to be a malay..gpms is another malay supremacist party anyway..

  5. leekh says:

    This is the face of liberal Islam. Our country’s boasts we are practioners of moderate Islam. Islam is a peaceful religion! The muslims are not interested in talking to other believers. They are only interested in talking down to others. In the Western World where the Christians are dominant, the Muslims sign petitions and demands to talk to the Christians. But go look in a country where Muslims are dominant or in the majority..do they want to talk to others? They want to talk down to you yes but not with you. Democracy can go to hell. This boasts about I will protect your right to speak even if I dont agree with you goes right out of the window in Islamic lands.

  6. Joshua says:

    I just googled for ‘official statistic muslim in china’.
    This is what I found:
    At present, according to official statistics there are 28 million Muslim in China but in1936 it was estimated that the Muslim population was 48 million. By this time total population has increased 3-4 fold. So we can conclude that the total Muslim population has increased minimum by that same proportion. Therefore, now the total Muslim population is at least 150 million. (source: http://www.islamicpopulation.com/china_muslim.html)

    My two cents here:
    http://takenotetakeheart.blogspot.com/2008/08/controversial-forum-on-conversion.html

  7. taliban bodoh says:

    This was written by that hypocrate moron mahaguru pondan about the bar council forum and he calls for the govt to detain all those involved under the isa, moron said,
    “Do Malaysian Muslims go around poking their nose into the Non Muslim Malaysians religious affairs?
    We don’t!
    We have lived in relative peace and harmony with our Non Muslims fellow citizens all these while.”
    WELL. WELL mr katak di bawah tempurung, If you don’t keep shoving your religion down our throats than we won’t mind but you morons keep doing it, anything that concerns racial discrimination against the other races , when confronted, you people foam at the mouth like dogs in heat, and screammmmmmm , this is ISLAMICCCCCC ISSSSUEEESSSS. think dickward, if you had any brains, why does everything has to and become an islamic isssue when you don’t know how to answer back and give a reasonable response, what is so special about such morons, always threatening, JANGAN CABAR, bullshiote!, woi go look at the mirror, before pointing fingers, WHO ARE THOSE MORONS GRABBING NON-MUSLIM BODIES TO BURY AS MUSLIMS, Y NOT ENOUGH MUSLIMS DYING, THAT YOU NEED TO FILL UP YOUR BURIAL GROUNDS, sometimes I think you guys have got no brains at all… well come to think about it, hitting the head on the floor and praying to a qube does that to you wouldn’t it, especially with the butts in the air, now its the ‘in’ thingy, no wonder we see some many pondans & gays sashying around visiting DPM s. go and checkout the malay artists association, you will see glorified QUEENS RUBBING SHOULDERS WITH UMNO VIP’S. to MR MAHA TALIGAN-GURU, EVEN YOUR NIK IS INDIAN, BLOODY PURKI MAMAK.
    where were you when moorthy’s corpse was snatched from his family.
    where were you when Indian, chinese, budhist & churches are demolished by little talibans.
    where were you when subhashini’s husband converted her chidren into islam when he wanted to divorce her, manipulating islam for his personal gain.
    this mahaguru pondan is the biggest moron lout and shite for brains i have ever come across, another example of our malaysian education system, a born looser looking for an identity.

    wasn’t this done by muslims under the guise of islam

  8. anti pakatan says:

    at the end of the day the most important indication of the real Anwar Ibrahim will be in his response….

  9. daniel says:

    i) pas’s and pkr’s reps in this (shallow) protests just show that pr supporters need to re-look at their priorities. they are many (hidden) like them.
    ii) some (not all) malays always tend to use terms & phrases like “menghina melayu/islam”, “jangan cabar”, “jangan main dengan api” etc… they are oh-so touchy. just goes to show how low their mentality is. just you move a finger or sneeze and they’ll wake from their slumber and yell those stupid utterances. it’s so easy to manipulate their emotions. they can’t (dont want to) control their emotions. they just blow their top over minor issues. say something and they’ll go “JANGAN MENCABAR…”, “JANGAN MAIN DENGAN API…”, “JANGAN MENGHINA…”.

    i mean hellooo…??? i am just trying to understand you(r religion) a bit. before i can finish me sentence you go all jumpy and what not.

    how to talk to people like them?? how indeed??

    i must qualify my above sentiments to apply only to selected ultra-malays. and like rpk asks, aren’t islam (as in most other religions) supposed to be race-blind? are they muslims or are they malays? they cant have it both ways. it’s WRONG in islam, i think.

    and while we’re at it. when was the last time you hear ANY malay (politicians or those stupid GABEM-like goons) fight for the REAL bumiputras’ (i.e. sabah & sarawak natives) rights??

    freaking hypocrites!

  10. caravanserai says:

    The fanatic Muslims should read the Holy Quran again
    Understand the wisdom enriched in its scriptures
    Then open their minds to see the changes in their eyes
    It is there bridging the gap for a family unity

    The freedom of religions embedded in the FC
    Why can’t these people understand it?
    The subject of conversion to Islam one shouldn’t feel offended
    It is good that Non-Muslims gathered to discuss about it

    So what’s the fanatic Muslims problem?
    Is it Islam better that other religions?
    Allah says He has perfected His religion Islam
    Into it He releases it to His children……….

    Nobody should run down somebody’s religion
    Islam teaches that earlier prophets must be appreciated
    And value their contributions to bring people closer to God
    What these fanatic Muslims do is a disgrace to Islam

    I feel sad that these fanatic Muslims can’t discuss fruitfully
    Amongst the people of other faiths………………………
    Tell me aren’t we the descendants of Adam and Eve?
    Learning the lessons from the previous prophets…..

    Holding placards in seditious drama
    Aren’t the police going to charge them?
    The people know the drills
    Nothing will come out of it

    Allah saves Malaysia
    For we have some narrow minded radical Muslims
    Parading the seditious illogical minds
    Let the freedom flow
    Allah will know what to do
    We should make our stay
    Fruitful and meaningful
    For our time here is fixed
    Why waste it?

  11. Shiok Guy says:

    Dear Susan,

    What exactly is your stand on this? From what i read, you are implying that we are not ready for the forum?

    My humble opinion is we should have started this forum like 50 years ago! Keep avoiding sensitive issues does not help, just like sweeping all the dirty under the carpet.

    I think the 300 odd protester are offered and asked to be part of the forum, why can’t we all seat down? When are we ready to sit down and discuss without any emotional outburst? Is this the teaching of Islam where it is Not Discussable? I am not an expert in the religion, but i think we all have the right to ask and learn.

    Isolation is not a solution. I was sad to see PKR MP among the protester and Kulim please get rid of him in next GE. I hope DSAI will deal with him strongly, BTW DSAI, Happy Birthday!

    http://shiokguy.blogspot.com/2008/08/happy-birthday-dsai.html

    Shiok Guy

  12. WW says:

    The demonstration against the forum clearly show us (at least myself) that only the weak and those who felt threatened will react in this manner. There is a saying in Chinese “true gold does not afraid of the fire”. So what’s the difference here to go with BN or PKR ? … food for thought.

  13. matt says:

    I say f..k the gpms bastards pantang di cabar puiiii,go to the nearest giant and buy yourself a life.

  14. patek1472 says:

    Q14. Freedom of religions and beliefs is a right of all Malaysians. (True or False)
    Kebebasan ugama dan kepercayaan adalah hak semua rakyat Malaysia (Betul atau Salah)

    Q15. Liberty is a right of all Malaysians. (True or False)
    Kebebasan diri adalah hak semua rakyat Malaysia. (Betul atau Salah)

    Q16. All Malaysians and the world can be converted to a single culture, religion, race in future. (Fact or Fiction)
    Semua rakyat Malaysia dan sedunia boleh diubahkan kepada suatu kebudayaan, ugama dan bangsa pada masa hadapan. (Fakta atau Rekaan)

    Q43. Divide and rule exists in all politics and religion. (Fact or Fiction)
    Memecah belah dan memerintah terdapat di semua fahaman politik dan ugama. (Fakta atau Rekaan)

    Q48. Freedom can only exist in the mind, not in real life. (True or False)
    Kebebasan Cuma didapati dalam minda, tidak di dunia nyata. (Betul atau Salah)

    Q49. Race and Religious supremacy are preached by satans. (True or False)
    Ketuanan bangsa dan ugama adalah dikutbah oleh syaitan. (Betul atau Salah)

    Q50. Malaysian politicians are typical Jeyklls and Hydes. (True or False)
    Ahli politik Malaysia melambangkan personality Jeyklls dan Hydes. (Betul atau Salah)

    Answers at http://patek1472.wordpress.com
    Jawapan di http://patek1472.wordpress.com

  15. MCI says:

    Stark difference for both sides of the Islam coin. One preaches peace and tolerance and another hooligans. Which is which?

  16. msiajoe says:

    Well, most muslims in China live in Xin Jian province. We see what happens there. Violence non-stop almost day and night. They adhere to their religious teachings of solving land autonomy dispute with force and weapons. Bloodshed is allowed by all means.

    Compare this to Tibetans who also fight their land independence. We can see a sharp contrast against muslims. Tibetans choose non-violent way most of the time.

    All over the world, wherever there are muslims, there is this teaching of lesser gentiles vs mighty and holy breed. Hence violence and bloodshed is allowed in any dispute if necessary. Discussion and dialogue don’t exist in their religious teaching.

    Democracy is nothing compare to well-being and feelings of their followers.

  17. ella-mae says:

    susan, thank u so much for this post. i’ve been walking around feeling terribly miserable after what had happened this morning… especially after seeing a PKR MP as one of the protestors. your post makes me feel so much better. yes sometimes we just have to put up with the name calling and choose to love those who call us vile names to make a change for a better tomorrow.

    change cannot be expected to happen overnight… i’m in the same mode of thought with u, dearest susan… conversion to democrazy first and then we address other issues.

    thank u again, susan. i can sleep peacefully tonight knowing malaysia still has a lot of hope… because of exeptional people like u🙂

    http://thedandelions.wordpress.com

  18. ella-mae says:

    it shld say democracy and not democrazy la😉 hahaha

  19. allen ng says:

    Susan,

    Our Muslim brothers and sisters should be tolerant and be brave to discuss this issue openly rather than keeping them in the dark.Sooner or later the issue of conversion of religion would be at boiling point if they keep on telling others not to discuss the issue.We are rational people and to discuss it with an open mind is better than waiting it to be exploded later,right?Threatening about racial riot would not serve the problem.It would aggravate the situation.

  20. Menyalak-er says:

    Are we ready for this forum?
    Answer is ambigious at best, as Susan herself has struggled to reach a ‘no verdict’.
    Islam does transcend politics in its pure unadulterated form, but as usual there is perversion along the way as in all religions.
    Islam is supposed to be a way of life as in all ‘Abrahamic’ religions, but then none of the practitioners comply.
    The arabization, iranization, talibanization and other -ations, are destroying the very fabric of its Message.
    To rational thinkers it may seem that Islam is actually at the stage when Martin Luther started the Great Reformation (Christian) in Germany in the 15th century. I’m no expert, but i believe that this is so, and it will take centuries, before rationality and peace returns.
    The real problem lies in the knee jerk reaction that every religious fundamentalist has, and this applies to all the religious, not spiritual disciples.
    While the discourse by the Bar Council is legitimate in a true democracy, who ever in their right mind says that Malaysia is one?
    Our nation at best, is a feudalistic state who prides itself as a ‘Constituitional Monarchy’ while practising parochial ‘divide and rule politics’ ever since its birth. What democracy, if the draconian ISA persists?
    It is only now, that true democracy is slowly seeping into the conciousness of the Malaysian public.
    Therefore, seeing it from the point of the fundamentalists, is it not legitimate for them to protest something that is beyond their ken?
    If one speaks for good, will not a thousand speak for the opposite?
    That is democracy – the rule of the majority, no matter how flawed we think it is. The herd instinct rears its ugly head, by provocations of the few.
    Therefore, would it not be better if this forum be held in a closed environment – for people who can understand these issues?
    It was unfortunately politicised by those who should have known better.
    Yes democracy and reformation of governance first! That should be our immediate aim.
    ‘Justice’ is in the eye of the beholder, therefore concentrate on the judiciary. It is really impossible to have 2 set of legal ethics in one nation as diverse as this! The lil’ nappies are having a field day – body snatching and all that.
    The envelope is fragile, and pushing its boundaries like this is akin to to catching a illusionary flame.
    Patience, preserverence and strength is the key to this paradigm shift.

  21. MJ says:

    As long this stupid blog( http://perakbangkit.blogspot.com/2008/08/ukm-maknanya-universiti-orang-melayu.html) still exist…I don’t think so bro….I’m malay/muslim…..but this racist chants by the perakbangkit.blogspot is too much…..hope that somebody should report this matter to the police.

  22. THUNDER says:

    Let this be a reminder to all non-Muslims who wish to convert to Islam that this country’s Islam is similar to the Taliban type – you can go in but you can’t get out. Socially, Indonesia and Turkey with their more modern forms of Islam, will definitely progress faster than this country.

  23. wandererAUS says:

    ‘SAMSENGS’ rule the day. Even if they were against this Bar Council forum, they should’nt be behaved so unruly and used offensive language. I find them pretenders of Islam and ignorant. They got it wrong, I suggest they grow up!

  24. ratormo says:

    Obviously the 300 protestors thought tht public forum on conversion is more sinful than blowing up your mistress with C4, fitnah (Anwar’s case), corruption, stealing, mat rempit, drug abuse etc. Maybe this is what islam-as-i-say-tion ha s produced after years of islamic abuse by muslim politicians on both sides. If muslims want non-muslim to respect Islam, they (muslim) must learn to respects islam first and not abuse it for their self-serving purposes. Muslims must realise tht islam is just like other religions and the rules for Islam shld be the same for other religion. the non-muslim is only asking for Muslims to be fair just like what islam stands for i.e, justice.

  25. rozlan says:

    Well I disagreed with muslim/malay organization who demonstrated against the Bar Council move to organized the said forum..Muslims shouldn t run amok with those type of activities.Face them gentlemanly..Challenge them for debate..let see whose religion are better…Televised the forum nationwide uncensored..I would like to see how far they could bring their argument..In fact most learned muslim could argue effectively with any religion and proving their religion is a hoax.Muslim dont need Al Quran for the arguments.Be like the late Ahmad Deedat.He used the Bible itself to argue with the Christians..

    I am not scared to debate..

  26. mr wan says:

    Dear Susan,

    I need to speak up as all this comments are misleading and biased only to one side. Yes, I know you all are symphatize to the bar Council as their rights to hold on to that forum had been denied. But the objectives to the forum itself have a serious cause and should be banned at the first place. Its rather a discussion on conversion on Islam but to whom who really know where the discussion will lead is as it will start questioning on Islam itself that will aggravate much serious cause to the public. Why the discussion needed at the first place. Its not just touching on Islam as you all know once a person convert to Islam, by rights she or he is a Muslim and why other people from different faith need to discuss or handling the matter on their behalf. It should let people from the same faith to handle the matter regarding their own belief and teachings. When you all trying to discuss on that doesnt it makes you all try to interfere to other relegious matter especially Islam which is our agama rasmi and Malaysia itself is a Muslim country. Its really sensitive when involved Islam, I must admit that but try to interfere and later start questioning on Islam itself is not a good move by the Bar Council . There is nothing to discuss as it will only lead to one thing as it will jeopardize our nation as Muslim are not going to compromise when someone start questioning and demeaning Islam. Thats the thing that we need to prevent from happening. Work out on the racial divide between us. Dont go for the relegious matter my fellow Malaysians and for Taliban Bodoh comments, you should be ashamed of yourself for making that such comments, either you are not from here or you are not mixing around with other fellow Malaysians which compromises different faith and culture.

  27. amoker says:

    I am ultimately dissappointed that mob and might is used against real engagement. This issue is sidestep all the time and the goverment and judiaciry just try to avoid making good decisions. Susan, no matter if it is open or closed door … they will not allow people who can think to talk. I think Article 11 is closed door, still the mob comes. I am equally dissapointed that the police decided that mob can cancel out events. Contrast that out with any other rallies, the police comes down hard on the protesters with the ‘no permit’ reasoning. What do you think if we form a mob during the UMNO GE? Would they still practice this principle ? Double standard.

  28. MC Leong says:

    Pharisees

  29. A friendly reminder for Parti KeADILan Rakyat…

    I’m not happy with some of the comments made by readers of Susan Loone’s latest blog post. It is obvious that the so called Freedom of Speech has been abused by some irresponsible parties (non-Muslims) to meddle into the affairs of Muslims. In such…

  30. IndependenceKid says:

    RPK says…
    Sure, I know, you are going to now scream, “Why target just the Muslims? There are also bad Jews, Christians, Hindus, Buddhists and whatnot. So why just target Muslims for criticism? Why not also whack the Jews, Christians, Hindus, Buddhists and whatnot?”

    The Jews, Christians, Hindus, Buddhists and whatnot do not run this country. The majority of the 1.2 million leaders and civil servants are Muslims. The policies and direction of this country are charted and guided by the Muslims. It is the Muslims who practically have absolute say in how this country is run and in what happens in this country. At best, those not of the Muslim faith are merely running dogs of the Muslims. These running dogs lie to their people by claiming that they are looking after the interest of their community whereas they are really selling their community down the drain and subjecting their community to the whims and fancies of the Muslims who are running this country.

    Listen to how Muslims talk. They foam at the mouth in defence of Islam. They slander and defile other religions. They declare all other religions as false and their holy books as fakes. They profess only Islam as the true religion, Muhammad as the final and legitimate Prophet, and the Quran as the only authentic book still in existence. Then they do everything that Islam is against without blinking an eyelid as if this is what God Himself prescribed.

    No, the non-Muslims do not moralise like the Muslims do. The non-Muslims are not patronising like the Muslims are. The non-Muslims do not talk down to those of other religions like the Muslims do. The non-Muslims do not preach that those not of their religion are the enemies of God who should not be taken as friends the way the Muslims preach.

    Yes, there are good Muslims and there are bad Muslims. There are also good people of the other religions and there are bad people of the other religions. But only Muslims pretend to be good when they are actually bad. Only Muslims talk about their religion non-stop while going against everything their religion stands for.

    Anwar described at great length what ails our country. Anwar described in great detail what ills our society is suffering from. But all that could have been explained in just one sentence. Muslims do not know how to be Muslims. Muslims do everything Islam is against. Muslims are hypocrites. That is what ails Malaysia. That is the sickness of our society. And that is why Malaysia is a lost cause as long as we have the majority 1.2 million leaders and civil servants coming from just one faith, the Muslim faith.

  31. Menyalak-er says:

    Exactly amoker, ‘double standards’ – what democracy?
    Do you really think article 11 truly exists for the fundamentalist in this nation? Think again.
    ‘mr. wan’ are you trying to say that all discussions on islamic conversions must be banned from the public arena? That corpse snatching etc must be banned from public scrutiny? If so, you’re sorely mistaken.
    It is the method, not the idea that is in question…

  32. sad man says:

    i think some of the BAR council officers has a hidden agenda to topple anuar
    – to hold the forum at this particular time where there will be by election soon.

  33. Diva Chin says:

    Interesting ‘development’
    Talking about the enemy of the state…
    The country will join the rank of pariah nation sooner then expected..

  34. Jed Yoong says:

    “Much as we might detest their move, we need to allow the group of 300-odd Muslim protestors have their say.”

    agree. but no need to behave like gangsta. some more ambiga invited them to participate…gentlemen sikit pun tak boleh ke?

  35. Ravindran Kunjan says:

    Dear All,

    Freedom of speech and assembly does not mean violence nor seditious utterances. It reflects the level of compromise. tolerance and respect of another malaysian citizen’s right to assemble and freely express the problems, of late, faced by many converted muslims, who in death and divorce, the individuals or their next of kin are faced with the difficulties in giving a proper burial according to their cultural believes or the question of properties, insurance and inheritance. Though, the fault lies in the converting parties for reasons best known to themselves, but, this has resulted in much hardship. I am sure no religion will encourage hardship.

    Definitely, the BAR Council was bona fide in their call to discuss the matter, however, sensitive. But, the instigation, was more from Najis & Botak Alba who claimed that it was better if the BAR cancelled the forum.

    If, the protesters have rights to voice out their opinions, then we should also respect the legitimate rights of the BAR. Mind you, the March 8 results of the 12 GE was a result of these issues about to be discussed and probably, come up with a win-win situation based on the fact that we are all Malaysians, irrespective of race, religion, creed, colour, political inclinations and thoughts.

    Violence and hard core disrespect of another by expressing seditious statements should not go unpunished. Even bloggers, who tell the truth, are punished under the Sedition Act, even if it is merely expressing frustration by replacing the tiger with a dog on an emblem of the authorities. However, the police deem it fit to call of a legitimate organization having a closed door forum to discuss legal issues pertaining to Article 121A.

    Instead of protesting in the manner so disrespectful to all Malaysians, the protesters/organizations involved/PAS/UMNO/BN/Pakatan/NGOs should have requested that they be represented in the forum and have a constructive discussion with views from both sides tabled and submitted to the government with recommendations & proposals. THIS WOULD HAVE BEEN HUMANE.

    I believe I heard the 8pm news saying that a explosive device exploded in Ms Sharizat’s residence, mistaken for Dato Ambiga’s( please, forgive me if I am wrong). This is not the Malaysian way. We should not allow the umnoputras/bn to have a reason to declare EMERGENCY; invoke the ISA like Ops Lalang whereby it will provide them the opportunity to arrest the PR/PKR leaders.

    This we must avoid. We must be more matured, tolerant, modest but NEVER NEVER VIOLENT.

    Malays, Indians, Chinese, Kadazans, Muruts, Ibans, Orang Asli, Portugese, and others are red blooded human beings with even similar blood types. Probably, in medical terms, one’s blood donated may have saved the other kind, but of the Malaysian race. Lets not be dragged into the “battle ground”
    of the losing umnoputras/bn.

    I believe, Dato’ Seri Anwar Ibrahim should step in by inviting the BAR Council to have a discussion with the Pakatan leaders. He could be the conduit pipe to the solution. The forum and its significance could be appreciated from all angles, rather than this nonsensical bickering, seditious incitement, violent reactions and criminal acts which could tarnish the status of Malaysians, who brought down Golliath on March 8.

    God Bless YAB Dato Seri Anwar Ibrahim, Dr Osman, Informers and all rational Malaysians.

    Malaysia for Malaysians.

    Ravindran Kunjan.

  36. Menyalak-er says:

    Hahaha, Jed indeed so…, ini bukan kampung!

  37. wasabi says:

    So live in a way the Maker expect you to live. Love one another and ur enemies for God is Love. Do not condemn anyone.

    Every one of us has to face our Maker one day.

  38. Feroz Merican says:

    Hello, Susan, I am glad you brought this up, it is a bigger problem than you think and one that threatens the very heart of Malaysia. You will never be able to convince your Muslim brothers and sisters on the need for an open, fair and just dialogue, because you are not dealing with the smartest Muslims here, but the dumbest, the most ignorant and the most ill-informed. These are the people who claim to represent our religion. The blind leading the dense. Why do you think I had to leave my beloved country to get married? Because of fools like these. You cannot reason with arrogance and insularity. Get used to it. As for the police, I am not surprised, the are the true pigs of Malaysia, but I am surprised at PKR and some of its leaders. I never trusted PKR, and it seems facts on the ground have borne me out. My opposition party was and will always be DAP. And Anwar better start talking fast about what he will do to and about the leaders who forced an adjournment of the Bar Council meeting. If he stays silent, he is a willing accomplice to racism and religious zealotry.

  39. wandererAUS says:

    mr wan;

    I do not question your religion, Islam. Matter of fact, I have great respect for it…even though, I am not a GOD fearing man. But, I do question the uncalled, unruly behavior of the protesters. Surely after 50 years of Merdeka, we should be more matured and educated to use civil approach to an issue that we may differ in this case on religion? I rather debate on an issue we differ and come to an amicable solution, then, to pretend it is not there.
    If we cannot do that, we are still not a civil society. How unfortunate!

  40. wits0 says:

    Menyalak-er, it clearly suggests that these 300 louts supports ketuanan agama – only theirs, of course, as written in stone and a fait accompli. So why should they debate what’s already theirs? This sinister implication as such is inescapable. This event will produce a negative image of Bolehland in democratic countries and hardly impress those co-religionist countries.

    BTW, where’s Chapto-poo on this? Slinking away as MCA always do on any issue of importance? He’s very happy cozying up to you because you handle him with well lub kid gloves. Haha!

  41. SadMalaysian says:

    Well this PAS guy has just given MCA one big ammunition to canvass for votes from the Chinese voters in PP for BN. Can you imagaine how STUPID? He may well have won the protest battle over the Bar Council but only at the gigantic cost of losing the PP war. Sigh!

  42. ramessh says:

    never use their brain tats the problem…. sure behind them are umno idiots.

  43. SadMalaysian says:

    Oops! This PKR guy.

  44. starwars says:

    I’m sure Bar Council’s intention was to make the forum as platform for general public to air their views on the current problems faced where spouses/families caught in the malaysia’s dual law system. So,when one half is not of the islamic faith, so how does one solve this problem? These types of forum should have been held long time ago. We will see again in the future problems cropping up b’cos these problems were never really addressed in the first place.

  45. sunwayopal says:

    Hey, I have an idea!

    To show how ridiculous the ‘consensual charge’ against DSAI is, can we start a petition to list down how many of us have engaged in ‘consensual oral sex’????

    By that same law they are charging DSAI with, consensual oral sex is also against the law!!!!!!

  46. Menyalak-er says:

    Wits0, problem is this ‘ketuanan agama’ is exactly that – it promotes even greater ‘gut reaction’ than the other ketuanan thingy. The language used in the Quran is akin to Latin used by medieval Catholics. Like the Christian fanatics of bygone eras, this is really a ‘gut reaction’ (meaning no disrespect). I don’t really think any fundamentalist cares very much about their image… thus begs the question: “Is the manner in which this ‘forum’ was done appropriate?” taking into consideration the raw emotions that it’ll surely elicit once the politicos get involved… Is there a hint of ‘immaturity’ on the part of the BAR Council or was it something else altogether… thus the relevance of Fairoz M.’s remarks to Dsai.
    Well chaps is busily elaborating the factionalism of his ghost party today. And coziness has it price… cheers.

  47. chaptokam says:

    witsOcrite are you jealous I am very happy cozying up to menyalak-er ? the problem with yours , I hate to say it TOO LOOSE , wonder what happen to the shit hole of yours ? hahaha

  48. Terong says:

    Malachy’s Prophecies – The Last 10 Popes……10. PETER THE ROMAN – The 112th prophesy states: “In the final persecution of the Holy Roman Church there will reign Petrus Romanus, who will feed his flock amid many tribulations; after which the seven-hilled city will be destroyed and the dreadful Judge will judge the people. The End.”
    http://www.bibleprobe.com/last10popes.htm

  49. Terong says:

    Malachy’s Prophecies – The Last 10 Popes……10. PETER THE ROMAN – The 112th prophesy states: “In the final persecution of the Holy Roman Church there will reign Petrus Romanus, who will feed his flock amid many tribulations; after which the seven-hilled city will be destroyed and the dreadful Judge will judge the people. The End.”
    bibleprobe.com/last10popes.htm

  50. Fortified City says:

    Could the Bar Council be a ‘tool’ to split up Pakatan Rakyat?

    Can religious overly zealousness in all religions be overcomed in this country ever?

    Is this religious issues tactic be used again and again to shift peoples attention away from really hopeless issues like the ailing economy and poor governance?

    Are the government agencies trying to stir emotions rather than rational thinking?

  51. Harrison says:

    Aiyoh, tsk…tsk…tsk… :suruh cina babi”-“pulang China pula”…Whew! Mana boleh. Kalau di Amerika Syarikat orang akan panggil “KKK”, tau beb?🙂

  52. HappyMalaysian says:

    I am so happy that Democracy prevails in Malaysia lah. The government has not buckled to US pressure to break the Rule of Law like they did to Iraq where latest documents reveal a conspiracy for oil involved. Now they are in conspiracy mode to assist Anwar to be PM. Think lah. Must be motive behind right???

  53. Najib (not DPM) says:

    To non-muslim, u can comment, but please do not condemn and insult Islam! U guys are too much already. It just show how much u guys dislike Muslim. Blog owner, if u support freedom of speech, u must also agree that everything has its limits.

  54. Think Lah says:

    Think lah Malaysians. Why this suspect brings pretty boy here and there alone? Overseas and local condominium? Why not pretty girl? Don’t you smell a rat if you see rat shit here and there? Even in politics, want to come from behind? Such unethical behavior can become PM kah? Habis lah Malaysia!!!

  55. Think Lah says:

    Think lah Malaysians. Why Anwar brings pretty boy here and there alone? Overseas and local condominium? Why not pretty girl? Don’t you smell a rat if you see rat s*** here and there? Even in politics, want to come from behind? Such unethical behavior can become PM kah? Habis lah Malaysia!!!

  56. Orang Kampung says:

    Jika suka main belakang
    Pergi duduklah diAmerika
    Jika politik suka pintu belakang
    Pergi duduklah diAmerika

  57. Now Think Lah says:

    Think Lah (00:34:16),

    U must be a very lost soul. U are at the wrong place (thread) at the wrong time (now it’s 2 am).

  58. Feroz Merican says:

    Orang Kampung, pantun lu standard satu pun dah fail. Kesian. Jangan lupa baca buku, bila besar cuba lagi. Lu bukan Usman Awang, lu Usman Bawang !

  59. goldenscreen says:

    These people really have very low EQ now doesn’t it? Hello Najib (not DPM), I wonder when you would expand the same amount of zeal and energy to criticize your fellow Muslims who also have overstepped the boundaries of free speech by uttering threats and racist insults. Oh, but I guess if it is a Malay overstepping the bounds of freedom of speech it is no problem at all isn’t it. Read my lips Najib (not DPM), you are a bloody HYPOCRITE, and if you don’t realize that then it’s 100% confirmed!

    Datuk Seri Anwar Ibrahim, sleep well tonight because starting from tomorrow you will get a headache in trying to extricate yourself and PKR from the mess created by Zulkifli Noordin. Good luck!

  60. wits0 says:

    Surely, goldenscreen, Datuk Seri Anwar Ibrahim has a real problem, indeed! He needs the luck.

  61. suiside69 says:

    Susan is right, there are more Muslims in China, and Islam reaches China more earlier than Malaya while my great great greatgrandfather are practising Hinduism or have no religion.
    Many Malay muslims are still in the box, including most my family members. I hope one day religious school students should learn to read Quran in Malay language form day one . Then they can understand the verses better instead of memorising the arabic verses without understanding the meaning. Not many Malays who memorise the “Holy Quran” verses understand the meaning, that includes me. ha ha
    If they understand with the open mind, there will be no demonstration against the forum today.
    I have been travel to China frequently also visiting several provinces and notice that the Muslims in China way of practise Islam is more open than us. Are we going to tell the world that the Malay way of practising Islam is better than Muslim Chinese in China.

  62. Menyalak-er says:

    Dear HappyMalaysian, i you’re surely behind the times. It is certainly not the US that’s conspiring with dsai, materially nor in anyway except morally.
    Last time i heard, it was Turkey, the UAE, Egypt, Indonesia and yes, the Saudi’s, which is Prophet Mohammad’s (PBUH) birthplace that is supporting dsai! Go check it out! The only nation that is supporting our powers to be is genocidal Sudan who caused the misery in Darfur (against fellow muslims, mind you).
    There are some amongst the ‘kaffirs’ who also disagree with this ‘forum’, although for different reasons.
    I’m a follower of Prophet Isa (PBUH), why do you call me ‘kaffir’ and other degoratory names, besides ‘babi’ and all that?
    Terdahulu meminta maaf, drp Muslimin/an, jikalah saya dgn tidak sengajanya, memperbahaskan apa2 shj. yg tidak ikhlas dan jujur.

  63. Victorian 1970 says:

    The Timing of this Forum is Highly questionable! Was this a distraction to divert the Rakyats mindset from the ongoing political issues?

    It is hard to believe that the Bar Council chose this week to address this issue , I only hope a group of intellectuals(supposedly the cream of our legal community) would have had the far thought and vision that we have more pressing issues and bigger fishes to fry! especially this week!

    First thing first – The right political, cultural, economic landscape needs to be in place before a discourse on an issue so divisive would have any meaningful results. Knowing very well this issue has been used to further the political agenda of many. You are playing right into their strategy.

    I dont know what the Bar Council leadership’s expectations were for this forum? Definitely not the negative outcome with its racial undertones!
    it is pretty evident from the outcome that this issue is diverting our attention from the progressive political movement currently sweeping the country.
    This is not a critical evaluation of the bar but its actions during a critical time in our nation’s history shows a lack of leadership, sensitivity, critical thinking nor strategy – one man’s opinion

    Majullah Malaysia!

  64. toyolbuster says:

    Well, listen here Sallehuddin Ayub and Zulkifli Noordin, we shall follow your political career right thru to GE13 and make sure it is short lived. And if Anwar decides to back them up, we shall do the appropriate too. Racists

  65. shadowmode says:

    guys,

    lets comment gentlemanly, stop pokin on each other. makin us blog homies look bad. the effin facist pigs look pretty low from their behaviour in the streets today so its more like em boys r just dissin emselves in front of the media. so chill . our country knows we love her.muaks =D

    do u know why we prevail? we tolerate everybody n create something out of nothing n excel in situations they think they ‘won’.

  66. NoktahHitam says:

    Religion can’t be discussed without proper knowledge. It’s like having sex, but backdoor entrance.

    It’s a big blow for Muslim, not Malays (generally). Afterall, we are not certain what’s the outcome of the forum, could be good, could be bad, could be a hiccup, could be the first stage, could be anything.

  67. temenggong says:

    Now if this incident had happened in the US, the consequences would be as follows.

    The police would have arrested the protesters and charged them in court for disturbance of the peace, for uttering defamatory statements, for hate speech, convicted and incarcerated. The groups involved would have been placed in the Hate Group Watch List. Additionally the Bar Council would have sued the groups involved, applied to freeze their bank accounts and assets, and bankrupted them. Furthermore there would have been a congressional hearing on such a matter and more laws would have been initiated to protect the citizens.

    This does not happen in Malaysia because are police and the AG are tools of the govt, and the judiciary is not independent but guided by race and religion.

  68. vishvenc says:

    Dear taliban bodoh,

    You said, “…when confronted, you people foam at the mouth like dogs in heat, and screammmmmmm , this is ISLAMICCCCCC ISSSSUEEESSSS.”

    I only wish to say that if we were to all follow your example, then foaming at the mouth while screaming out random names such as moron, dickwad, pondan, etc, is better than doing it in the name of religion?

    Funny how those who accuse others of hypocrisy are often its most ardent practitioners.

    -Vish.

  69. Aru says:

    Their unruly look by they way of janggut ” beard” looks evelish.They look like gangsters and with rage.They are not muslims .Any religious person will look calm in adverse situation .Not this rage manner,calling names etc.Is this what Islam professes.I think the non muslims are calmer and has better understanding of their religion that allows them to understand Islam.
    GOD does not need these dumboes to protect his way.
    These mopsters are paid by fannatical ,taliban gov such as PAS and UMNO.

  70. […] Conversion to democracy first, then Islam…(2) [image] [image] (pix: Malaysiakini) (@ 4.32AM, 10 August) : According to […]

  71. Jt says:

    Aren’t you sick of perpetually being told “balik Cina”? Well I am. I am a 4th generation CHINESE Malaysian and if given the choice I would leave this country and if China will accept me and my family I will go back to China. A lot of us do not wish to stay here but we have no choice as our ancestors have made that choice for us. But I will ensure my children will have a choice.

    The Muslims here (not all are true Malays) are vicious, cruel and narrow minded. They are so insecure in themselves and their religion that they can only spew out repeatedly “balik Cina”. They should open their eyes and look at other countries. Countries like US and UK – they have citizens of all races who are proud to call themselves English or American though they are not white. But in this country, we are not proud to be Malaysians because we are always made to feel unwanted and intimidated. Eventhough we have contributed hugely to this country it is not appreciated. No wonder Malaysia is the pariah of the world on the ranks of Zimbabwe.

  72. Isa X says:

    1.So why the BAR idea not considered malicious and provocative? 2.What dialogue are they “you” seeking from a people with a 1400 year custom? 3.Why is the Bandar Kulim MP label a hard liner now?
    India like China have more Muslims than Malaysia but that does not denote the influence and founding institutions by way of numbers. Have you not realized the hatred from your respondents in your blog? What are you telling us that this is all the Muslim fault also. I disagree with the name calling yet I refuse to pander to your condescension of innocence. This hatred comes from all quarters and until you all come to appreciate that none of us can move the sun and the moon from where they stand there will always be antagonist.
    The BAR attempt to diminish indigenous Muslim rights and customs in a all too pretentious dialogue is a betrayal of civility and boarders on a coup. The March 8 election results and the current political uncertainty was not due to Muslim or Islamic tradition in Malaysia but that failures for accountability unbridled corruption and ineptitude across the board. There are elements who believe that this is an opportune moment to belt the Muslims and ransom the country of its norms and founding traditions- well sorry….That demo sends a warning otherwise. For your information Islam and Muslims are violently kept in check both in China Kashmir and India proper. So have a good look before you attempt to trivialise the Malays guard on their customs and way of life. However I implore you, Malays it is not proper that you refer to your fellow brother as pigs- this is an insult also to God and His messengers.
    And for those of you sighting the US as an example for any issues of democracy freedom and justice – by GOD you don’t have to go there – just read….I lived in the US; you have no idea of the US except its Hollywood and media fallacies impressed on the rest of the world.
    Judging from your disgust ill or uninformed or both points of views I can only ask: are you all happy with the slaughter of over 1million Iraqis and the pretext by which this mass killings were executed? For your information they weren’t all Muslims though majority are and the thousands of brown Christians who were considered collateral damage.
    I have not read or experience similar out pouring of hatred towards Britain and the US as I am witnessing here both by our host blogger and its contributors. How dare you site America as an example where it contains the biggest prison population in the world/history and the black brown and chinky eye people are often targets of abuse due to inherent racist that forms America’s reactionary safety valve. Why is it that in Malaysia we have to surrender our traditions and customs because it is deemed unfair when at the same time you wish to invoke your customs and perceived rights as equitable and just? Aren’t we Muslims loosing our rights then?

  73. SK Cheah says:

    Susan,
    We know that SOME muslims in THIS country go ranting mad when non muslims discuss about conversion to Islam or vice versa. I suggest the Bar Council get the approval from His Royal Highness before holding such forums.

  74. Aiyoo Tambi says:

    Roses are Red,
    Violets are Blue,
    Some people will never change,
    No matter what you do.

  75. TubeMoose says:

    Muslims can talk about racial unity and tolerance until the cows come home, but bring in religion, and suddenly all bets are off.

  76. Taikohtai says:

    Remember the Bali bombers who are now in jail awaiting execution? Yes, these killers were jumping up and down when given the death sentence because they think they will go down as martyrs. But on the other hand, they are fighting the courts to avoid the firing squad!
    I think we are looking at the same mentality here.
    Yes, Muslims are tolerant, peaceful and law abiding…….. But the moment you want to talk about conversions, etc, their true nature appears. Suddenly they totally contradict everything they are supposed to be in the first place!
    Sorry guys but I do think that too many practitioners of the Islamic faith are bordering on CULT status.

  77. Isa X says:

    By Davy de Verteuil
    Trinidad & Tobago

    1. So why the Bar Council idea is not considered malicious and provocative?
    2. What dialogue is the Bar Council “you” seeking from a people with a 1400 year custom?
    3. Why is the Bandar Kulim MP label a hard liner now?
    India like China has more Muslims than Malaysia but that does not denote the influence and founding institutions by way of numbers.
    For your information Islam and Muslims are violently kept in check both in China Kashmir and India proper. So have a good look before you attempt to trivialise the Malays guard on their customs and way of life.
    However I implore you Malays, it is not proper that you refer to your fellow brothers as pigs- this is an insult also to God and His messengers. We are all part of the human family created by GOD and this goes against the essence of Islamic enlightenment.
    Have you not realized the hatred from your respondents in your blog?
    What are you telling us that this reactionary behaviour is entirely the Muslims fault also?
    I disagree with the name calling yet I refuse to pander to your condescension of innocence as you aim is. Your sarcasms betrays the rational here.
    This hatred comes from all quarters and until you all come to appreciate that none of us can move the sun and the moon from where they stand there will always be antagonist.
    The Bar Council attempt to diminish indigenous Muslim rights and customs in an all too pretentious dialogue is a betrayal of civility and boarders on a coup.
    The March 8 election results and the current political uncertainty was not due to Muslim or Islamic tradition in Malaysia but that failures for accountability unbridled corruption and ineptitude across the board.
    There are elements who believe that this is an opportune moment to belt the Muslims and ransom the country of its norms and founding traditions- well sorry….That demo sends a warning otherwise.
    And for those of you sighting the US as an example on any issues of democracy freedom and justice – by GOD you don’t have to go there – just read….I lived and was educated in the US and Canada; you have no idea of the US except for its Hollywood and media fallacies impressed on the rest of the world.
    Judging from your disgusted ill or uninformed or both; points of views I can only ask: are you all happy with the slaughter of over 1million Iraqis and the pretext by which this mass killings were executed? For your information they weren’t all Muslims though majority are and the thousands of brown Christians who were considered collateral damage that perished.
    I have not read or experience similar out pouring of hatred towards Britain and the US as I am witnessing here both by the host blogger and its contributors.
    How dare you site America as an example where it contains the biggest prison population in the world/history and the black brown and chinky eye peoples are often targets of abuse due to inherent unrepentant racist that forms America’s reactionary safety valve?
    Why is it that in Malaysia the indigenous have to surrender their traditions and customs because it is deemed unfair when at the same time you “Bar Council” wished to invoke your customs and perceived rights as equitable and just? Aren’t the Malay Muslims losing their rights then? I am not afraid to say this; The Malays like everyone else are this nation, but they are the earlier ones.
    From the desk of an Arawak African & Indian in ‘ONE’ the beautiful Islands in the Caribbean.
    Arawak is whom you refer to as American Indian or Red Indian.
    Indigenous rights are my business. No apology.

  78. wits0 says:

    What makes a Cult? One can find out for himself/herself:
    (Those who puts the cart before the horse will not be able to)

    Bonewits’ Cult Evaluation
    http://www.teenwitch.com/unclassified/cultevaluation.html
    http://www.sanguinarius.org/ABCDEF.shtml

  79. Terong says:

    Not all Malays are Muslims.

  80. ray111 says:

    That PKR Kulim MP have forgotten that he represents PKR which is suppose to be multi racial and color blind and being a lawyer himself, he should know what and why the Bar Council forum is about. I think he wants to gain support from Malays as he is going to lose his Kulim seat soon and he will probably jump ship back to UMNO. He has forgotten that non malays in Kulim voted him too. How can he says that the President of Bar Council must be Malay? He is such a asshole to say that! If there is any deserving Malay lawyers who has the capability to be the President, I am sure he or she will be voted in. How can he be so spupid to put up such request? He deserves to be arrested under ISA! Real Asshole MP. I pray that he lose his Kulim seat and vanish from Malaysia politics. How can this country have such a racist MP. He is no different from BN MP!!

  81. chaptokam says:

    Jed Yoong (22:56:26) :

    “Much as we might detest their move, we need to allow the group of 300-odd Muslim protestors have their say.”

    Why don’t you look at it the other way ? jed , why don’t they as politicians allow the bar council have their forum in a closed environment procced without any interference from them ? And from their atitude , smacks of the episode where a reporter was punch and kicked for taking photographs of DSAI . You are dealing with a bunch of janggut ” bearded talibans who doesn’t understand the word civility , racial unity and tolerance , freedom of religions and beliefs is a right of all Malaysians.
    Your comments lately on various issues suggest you need to so some soul searching for yourself .

  82. whispering9 says:

    Methinks the Bar Council is either an idealist or a complainer. Even in a near perfect harmony, you will always find a pocket of people who will not share your same view on just about anything. The loud 300 (almost comically similar to Legend 300) is just about that small pocket representation who do not share the same ideal with you. My question is “Why does the Bar Council sought to disrupt the current path in reforming our democracy by going ahead with the loudly advertised and finally aborted Forum.” Personally, it just another sodomy by a different kind. We are made by this forum as an unwitting perpetrator. Shameful, really, Ms. Bar Council.

  83. alrawa says:

    Shahrizat bought ‘the house’ from Ambiga. What does that tell you?

  84. wits0 says:

    It’s rather disingenuous to blame the Bar Council for the Forum or its timing, since the said body is not a political one , per se.

    SK Cheah, please note that the hate speech matter of the Mufti of Perak here has not being fairly resolved – see end of video, esp.:
    http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=G9zmRMoDt58
    (He was also responsible for the infamous church siege but passed the blame to another instead.)

    Some people has the sole right to hate speech and passthe blame to the lain lain for the “provocation”, etc. This is an old problem much indulged by the System and naturally must resurface.

  85. wits0 says:

    “Shahrizat bought ‘the house’ from Ambiga. What does that tell you?”
    I have noted that but that does not prove anything much.

  86. matt says:

    Change of govt might bring change of thoughts, maybe this is the only hope otherwise nothing changes.Ambiga looks like you have proved to be a real govt lackey,step down if you have a conscience.

  87. Towering Malay says:

    Sharizat is a lawyer, so it is natural for her to had some contact with Ambiga. Just as Karpal too would have. mamaks usually try to make something out of it.
    While the ISA is there no harm in waving it around once in a while.
    That mamak fellow with bengkak on his forehead with too much banging on the floor, Mahaguru, should also have been ISAed.
    Sigh, maybe next time round.

  88. Towering Malay says:

    Bar Council should hold more of these forums so non muslims are made aware of the rights of body snatchers.
    Too many cases are making the syariah courts powerful and making them perverted.
    Why the protests? There must be something wrong with their religion if they don`t want the nons to know about it. So they riot to keep the nons in ignorance.
    Thank you MCA, MIC, Gerakan, PPP for ignorance. May you rot.

  89. Rajes says:

    Body snatching is in vogue because of the non muslim ignorance. How many elderly people have been converted under suspicious circumstances we do not know. Their families will only find out when the `convert` is dead.
    This is one way to take money from non malays and give it to the malays (who are all muslims). In other countries it would be called robbery.

  90. Rajes says:

    I look forward to the day when Hamid Albar, Rais, Najis, Badawi etc are all under ISA. Nik Aziz and Hadi of PAS also. Put them in the same block where they will find peace in mutual head banging.

  91. Pigman says:

    ‘Shouts of “babi”, “pengkhianat” and “balik China” were heard as forum participants trickled out of the venue’ (Malaysiakini )
    http://imagineequality.blogspot.com/2008/08/babi-balik-china.html

    And this by a protest led by a PKR leader with PAS hantus. They want non muslim votes. They come my house I slap them. At the end they are the same. Greedy people who do not deserve to live in this world.

  92. chaiong says:

    I smell something fishy that this event happens at the peak of PP bi-election! This Kulim guy must have been offered tons of honey to overturn his boss. Politics stinks!

  93. Pigman says:

    Malay Women in Malaysia (22:35:38) :
    A friendly reminder for Parti KeADILan Rakyat…
    I’m not happy with some of the comments made by readers of Susan Loone’s latest blog post. It is obvious that the so called Freedom of Speech has been abused by some irresponsible parties (non-Muslims) to meddle into the affairs of Muslims. In such…
    ___________________________________________________________________

    If you are not happy, I`m the least bothered. We are not in this world to make you happy. You are just like all your fellows thinking the world owes you a living.
    If you really are a woman then you are a bitch. At least you get multiple screws, be happy with that.

  94. matt says:

    chaiong you maybe right as the timing of it all stinks and as you know desperate times require desperate measures[umno].

  95. data says:

    I’m not happy with some of the comments made by readers of Susan Loone’s latest blog post. – Malay Women in Malaysia 22:35

    Bitch, you also need ISA for interfering with non-muslim rights

  96. Lord, we want to pray to you above
    For your creations on earth numbering 300
    Who have yet to know you really as God of love
    May they all find your freedom while their blood is red

    (C) Samuel Goh Kim Eng – 100808
    http://MotivationInMotion.blogspot.com
    Sun. 10th Aug. 2008.

  97. Ahjajal says:

    As a Muslim it is our right to unite and protect Islam . Before Muslim
    goes and protest they must understand what they are protesting for. It is better to hear and understand first before going an do something silly. Political
    parties must not use Islam just to get them popular.

  98. ruddy says:

    These are cowards and PKR should sack that Kulim MP so he can join PAS. He should stay under ISA for the next 20 years or till he dies.
    If Anwar does the same, he also should suffer the same. In fact Anwar`s so called sufferings is because of what he was at one time. That is very good.

  99. ruddy says:

    Hahaha Kulim MP cannot understand what they are protesting for?

  100. data says:

    Hahaha Kulim MP cannot understand what they are protesting for?

  101. al salam says:

    WHY THE MUSLIM ARE SO INTERESTED IN DEAD BODY OF THE NON MALAYS.?MAY BE THE MORE THE DEAD BODY OF NON MALAYS THE MUSLIMS GET TO BURY-THE DOOR TO HEANEN IS OPEN WIDER FOR THEM.WE ARE ONLY ONLY DICUSSING OUR PROBLEM OF OUR FATHER,MOTHER CONVERTING TO ISLAM AND PROBLEMS ARISING TO THE NON MUSLIMS SPOUSES AS A RESULT OF THE COVERSION.WE ARAE DISCUSSING OUR PROBLEM,NOT THE MUSLIM RELIGION OR THEIR KETUANAN.WHY THEIR RELIGIOUS TEACHER AND SCHOLARS FAILED TO TEACH THEM THE UNDERSTANDING ABOUT OTHER RELIGION.ARE THERE,THE MALAY MUSLIM PEOPLE DONT LIKE,DONT WANT OR SIMPLY DONT WANT TO ENGAGE IN HEALTH TALKING?ARE WE HAVE TO BLAME THE EDUCATION SYSTEM FOR THIS MALADY,FOR PRODUCING NON RATIONAL THINKING MALAYS.KEPADA SEMUA ORANG MELAYU ISLAM KENAPA KAH KITA TAK BOLIH BINCANG ISU BAPAK KITA,EMAK KITA YANG TIBA MASUK ISLAM TINGGALKAN ANAK ANAK DALAM SATU KEADAAN SERBA SALAH DAN KENAPA KITA TAK BOLIH TUNTUT MAYAT EMAK,BAPAK,ABANG ADIK DAN ANAK KITA?KENAPA MASA DIA ORANG DI HANTAR DI DIA ADALAH SEORANG HINDU ,BUDDHA ATAU KRISTIAN DAN TIBA TIBA APABILA MATI ,DIA MATI JADI ISLAM.APA KAH KERAN KITA MALAYSIA KITA TIDAK DILINDUNGI UNDANG KELUARGA.UNDANG KELUARGA NAK PAKAI.CUBA U ORANG ISLAM MELAYU FIKR DAN BAGI JAWAPAN.DIA MANAKAH KITA KENA MENGADU PERKARA INI KALAU BUKAN DENGAN BAR COUCIL DENGAN SIAPA LAGI?KERJAAN TAK MAU AMBIL TAU TAPI CUKUP LIMA TAHUN DIA MAU UNDI DARI ORANG BUKAN MELAYU.

  102. adam says:

    malaysia is destined to be a muslim country. if not now….it will surely become an islamic country in 20 to 30 years. no other choice for others…. MIGRATE!!!

  103. data says:

    WHY THE MUSLIM ARE SO INTERESTED IN DEAD BODY OF THE NON MALAYS.?MAY BE THE MORE THE DEAD BODY OF NON MALAYS THE MUSLIMS GET TO BURY-THE DOOR TO HEANEN IS OPEN WIDER FOR THEM – al salam

    YES. They are guaranteed a place in heaven for their sucesful jihad. There they will run after virgins and raisins.

  104. data says:

    This F___king B__t_ard also want to migrate to Zimbabwe:

    KUALA TERENGGANU, Aug 10 – Saying he did not want anyone like Datuk Seri Anwar Ibrahim “who stabbed him in the back” as Prime Minister, Tun Dr. Mahathir Mohamad said yesterday he would rather migrate if the former deputy prime minister succeeds in toppling the Barisan Nasional government.

    “If he comes Prime Minister, I will get out of the country. Give everything to him,” Utusan Malaysia quoted the former prime minister’s reply to a question at the Current Challenges for Malays forum here.

    However, the acerbic Dr Mahathir was confident that Anwar will not become Prime Minister by September 16 although he was sure his former protégé would be victorious in the Permatang Pauh parliamentary by-election this Aug 26.

    He said Anwar was greedy enough for support that he would forsake the special privileges for his own race to cooperate with the Hindu Rights Action Force (Hindraf) which is filled with racism.

    – The Malaysian Insider

  105. FIRDAUS AL AMIN says:

    ORANG ORANG YANG PROTES DIHADAPAN BAR COUNCIL-ADAKAH KAMU KAMU FAHAM KENAPA U PROTES-BANYAK SAYA TENGOK PELJAR GPMS.KAMU JANGALH JADI ALAT PARTI POLITIK DAN NGO YANG ADA AGENDA MASING.U ORANG TAU TAK TAK APA DIA ORANG?JANGAN JADI SEGOROMBALAN KAMBING BIRI TUAN SURUH PI SANA SINI DIA IKUT.300 ORANG YANG PROTES ITU ADA LAH KAMBING KAMBING -KAMBING DIKETUAI OLIH GEMBALA NAM ZULKFLI NORDIN,MUFTI PERAK,KETUA PEMUDA PAS DAN KETUA GANG MAMAK KIMMA-PENGEMBALA DARI INDIA.

  106. Tears says:

    So now in his old age the kutty wants to run off after crapping all over malaysia.
    Big trouble for India more bombings etc if this sodomist goes to kerala.

  107. rozlan says:

    Actually the demonstration was an UMNO trap..Why PAS members didnt learned from their past experiences…YOU see the demonstrators were mixed members from PAS,UMNO,muslim NGOs.But why a PAS leader was arrested??What about others from UMNO and UMNO controlled NGO i.e GPMS???

    UMNO now is trying to gain back their popularity but not at their expenses.

  108. Tears says:

    PAS only talks sweet in front, but their hearts are black – Nik Azis included. Don`t get taken in by one or 2 statues in Kelantan. That is for show saja. PAS is playing the dirty game by pressuring UMNO and saying other things to non-muslims.
    I know because I have read their Harakah, and I know what they write in their religious bahasa columns. Some of it is blood boiling.
    NEVER TRUST PAS or UMNO. By right they should merge.

  109. Tears says:

    There should be full investigation by UN on how PAS and UMNO are helping the Thai insurgents in the South.

  110. Ctizen Me says:

    Married Non malay men and women should only be allowed to convert to any religon after they have divorced their spouses. And once they convert they have to abide by the rules of their new religion. If we do not observe this we are we are in for alot of trouble.

  111. Land of witchcraft says:

    If you were to ask me ,I will tell you this land is a land of witchcraft like some African countries,Indonesia,Thailand etc.

    The sin of witchcraft is seeking the help of demons and Satan to destroy another. The True Creator God will not help you in this. If you want to destroy one another you have to go to Satan and the demons for help. Satan and its demons are the authors of strife,jealousy,pride, arrogance,envy, factions,dissenssions,greed,malice,lies,deceit and etc.

    It might seem like you are being ‘helped’ by God but its actually not. You have been deceived by the very tricky demons and cunning Satan to destroy one another.

    Well the choice is still yours… you can follow God’s ways which are love,joy,peace,justice,righteousness,kindness…… or you can keep on destroying mankind with the help of Satan and its ugly demons. Those who follow Satan’s ways are often self-destructive people. Give a serious thought to your ways.

  112. Samson says:

    When PAS and UMNO wanted to have secret talk on Malay/Muslim unity, did the non-muslim acted like uneducated hooligans protesting the events and challenging the Malays, “Jangan Main Api”?

    Why must the majority of Malay/Muslims be felt threatened if what they professed in their faith is the truth? The more they prevent such peaceful dialogs the more I feel that they are afraid and are trying to hide God knows or don’t know what…untruth about Islam?

    From what happened to the forum, the question in the mind of majority of non-muslims is that is there any tolerance in Islam?, Can Islam be debated?. What happened to the forum shows that in Islam “I am right and you are wrong”. Whatever it is your view and your life is not important. Yes you have put a lot fears to all non muslim with all your actions.

    Talking about sensitivity. You asked non-muslims to be sensitived to Islam but have you ever consider the sensitivity of non muslims in their professed faiths?

    Finally, DO UNTO OTHERS WHAT YOU WANT OTHERS DO UNTO YOU.

  113. data says:

    Malaysia and the satan club of doom:

    “I must report to you that many non-Muslims feel marginalised in today’s Malaysia. There is growing discomfort with the rapid Islamisation of our society. Universal values of ethical conduct and good governance, values which are shared by all religions, are appropriated by some to be only “Islamic”, ” he said at the 25th anniversary of the council.

    He cautioned the Prime Minister – the guest-of-honour – that unless concrete steps were taken to assure 45 per cent of Malaysia’s population of fair treatment, the outflow of talent from the country would continue unabated.

    Abdullah thanked him for his honesty and made the usual sounds on the need to be fair to all races. But even the PM knows that his government has not come close to delivering on any promises to non-Muslims since he came to power in October 2003.

    Questions of body snatching or the status of burial rights for non-Muslims whose conversion to Islam was unknown to the dead person’s family remain unresolved.

    Abdullah promised to put in place a mechanism after the nastiness surrounding the burial of Everest hero Moorthy in 2006.

    Little has changed since then.

    http://themalaysianinsider.com/index.php/headlines/42-lead-stories/2785-leader-of-all-malaysians-yeah-right

  114. souse says:

    One of the speakers on the night was someone who had earlier in the day been protesting against the Bar Council forum. After rubbing shoulders with Umno protesters in the morning, this time he was telling Umno, “Jangan cabar kita”…etc etc”

    http://anilnetto.com/malaysian-elections/another-large-crowd-in-permatang-pauh/

    Hypocrites!

  115. souse says:

    It takes the DAP younger member such as Petaling Jaya Utara MP Tony Pua to put in plain words of what he thinks of the whole situation.

    Stating that the Bar Council is the most appropriate organisation to lead discussions on the Constitution and the laws of Malaysia was the Bar Council, he said it would make a complete mockery of our legal and judicial system if its very practitioners were denied opportunities to discuss or explain the laws.

    He was also disappointed with the protest led by PKR’s Kulim-Bandar Baharu MP Zulkifli Noordin, saying that the protest was not only misguided but also immature and unconstructive.

    “If discussing our constitution and our laws is equivalent to “Islam-bashing”, then he (Zulkifli) needs to have his head inspected. The forum did not create the “hoo-haa”. It is “leaders” like him who fail to understand simple principles who mislead others into thinking that the whole world is against them.

    “Well, it appears that this type of thuggish and loutish behaviour is unfortunately not only limited to Umno Youth,” he added.

    Despite the deafening silence among the non-Malay parties, particularly the MCA, Gerakan and MIC despite having been demanding for more freedom and tolerant among the people, a lone MIC voice was heard yesterday.

    MIC Youth coordinator T. Mohan in a statement posted on the internet said the movement strongly condemned the tactics of irresponsible groups in disrupting the forum.

    He also expressed concerns that statements made by certain leaders who had opposed the forum had caused resentment among the non-Muslims.

    http://themalaysianinsider.com/index.php/headlines/42-lead-stories/2787-muted-response-from-the-non-muslim-groups

  116. chauncey gardener says:

    The UK has changed some of the matrimonial legal structures regarding Islamic marriages, giving a measure of gender equality that was previously absent.

    See
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/2518720/New-Sharia-law-marraige-contract-gives-Muslim-women-rights.html

    Is Malaysia equally progressive in terms of having dynamic syariah laws ? The action of a few and deafening silence seems to indicate that nobody dares.

  117. MelaysiaScrewedUp says:

    Shouts “Balik China” !!!

    Table it in parlimen. Then get UN to grant all Non malay for “refugee” status and give 5 years time frame for Non malay to leave.

  118. Shiok Guy says:

    I despite what the MP from Kulim did, but I respect his right to voice out.

    Offcos I will exercise my right to vote him out if I am a voter in Kulim, because I don’t agree with what he is doing. If he choose to sit down and engaged in the forum like a human being, he will gained my respect!

    ISA against HIM? No Way and that’s simply goes against the thing that we fight for, freedom of expression! A balancing act? No way, not this way.. A balancing act will be voting him out. Period!

    Shiok Guy

  119. Ctizen Me says:

    We have to go back to basics.
    1. When you are married under civil law only that same civil law can declare your marriage nul and void
    2. Your marriage under civil law cannot be decalred nul and void just because you change your religion
    3 Married non malays who want to convert to another religion should first divorce their spouses otherwise they can be charged for bigamy.
    4. And please, those who convert do so with you thinking caps on.

  120. KongKor says:

    I do not see any problem if people want to demo for or against any given cause, be from PKR or BN/UMNO or for that matter any Malaysian. As long as it is within the parameters of acceptable norms.

    What is most sickening is how these people uses Islam and making a mockery in the name of Islam or any other religion. So, if this case involving a Kulim Adun from PKR inciting hatred and resort to name calling, I would agree with the action of the police to detain him. Then again, those from PAS and UMNO should be arrested too.

    When will Malaysian ever grow up and come to terms with demoCRAZY?

  121. Feroz Merican says:

    Is Anwar going to censure Zulkifli Noordin? Will he be kicked out from the party? Who needs enemies with friends like that? I guarantee Anwar will say nothing, he knows he has more to lose if he acts against Mr. Noordin, and that’s just the way it is. You cannot have real Democracy in a country walking on the eggshells of racial politics. Unless you institute and anoint a Military Dictator, religion and racism will always come between us.
    PS. Why don’t Malays of Indonesian descent (Jawa) go back to Indonesia? You’re not Malaysian, you’re Indonesian so don’t be so quick to tell others to leave. My grandmother was of arabic descent and she respected Indians and Chinese and Eurasians because they were good people and worked hard.
    My Grandmother treated people with respect and she had no time for narrow minded, small thinking and uneducated people who thought they were special just because they were given the status of Bumiputera from a Govt more interested in staying in power than in listening to the will of the people. A Govt that would say anything to anyone as long as it would help them win votes that they did not deserve.

  122. wits0 says:

    Feroz Merican: “I guarantee Anwar will say nothing, he knows he has more to lose if he acts against Mr. Noordin, …”

    You got it, old chap! That’s the problem and one everyone will notice this in this Age of the Internet.

  123. mikewang says:

    Even though I am a ardent supporter of Anwar to rid this country of corruption and chart us to a new Malaysia where Ketuan Rakyat will replace ketuanan kaum, I am disgusted with leaders who threaten others with violence for expression a differing opinion.

    Zulkifli Noordin must be charged in court for threatening the democratic rights of others with violence and the PKR leadership must disassociate itself with him.

  124. wits0 says:

    Fascism is as Fascism does
    http://tinyurl.com/5wlcr5

  125. Feroz Merican says:

    Witso, and that is the problem, remember the Beauty Contest Fiasco? Mahathir leaves the country, tells Anwar to run it as acting PM for a couple of months and next thing, police are grabbing Malay girls off the stage in a Beauty Pageant, reason being, “it is indecent”. Mahathir comes back, has a fit. Anwar wouldn’t lift a finger for non malays if he had a choice. I remember all the nonsense that went on when Anwar was DPM, if it was up to him, all Malay girls would be thrown in jail for “insulting Islam”. Say what you want about Mahathir, but he never would have let the country deteriorate to such an extent, he was very conscious of Malaysia’s image overseas. He was fighting the Talibanization and Iranization and Saudi-ization of this country, as my friend Menyalak mention in an earlier comment. Mahathir’s biggest enemy was Pas and Al-Arqam, and looked at how he handled Al-Arqam, and now look at how Anwar is “handling” Pas, and of course Zulkifly Noordin. If it was up to Anwar, rock concerts would also be banned, so much for “freedom of expression” and a new, better Malaysia. An ABIM leader never changes his spots. Angkatan Belia Islam Malaysia, in case you forgot.

  126. amomentwithgravity says:

    it’s just human being. we blamed and punished and mocked people for something you can’t change i.e. race. not only the malays are racist, everyone is at one point. in regards to religion, sometimes love (be it love to human or business etc.) makes people blind.

  127. Volcano says:

    Serve him right.
    After ISA should send him to Guantanamo.
    Then send back to indonesia where he belongs.
    We don’t need these extremist in Malaysia.
    Yes, Zul, Rights of Islam must be protect.
    This does not mean that you can deny the rights of others to express.

  128. taliban bodoh says:

    The photograph above shows the faces of graduates of our Universiti- pondok- nep- DUNGUS. here is a question for all of you, HOW DO YOU REASON, WITH THE UNREASONABLE? HOW DO YOU EXPLAIN THINGS IMBECILES AND MORONS. They started protesting without understanding, what the forum was all about, well to the zulkifli noordin I say this, padan muka, Jolly good show moron, eventhough I voted for pakatan, I will call a spade a spade, ZUL YOU MORON ENJOY YOUR STAY IN TAIPING YOU RACIST PIG, AND TO THE REST OF THE TURBAN-wearing-pseudo-talibans-with-shit for-brains, go get a life. THIS IS THE PROBLEM WITH THE MALAYS, TOO STUPID TO BE TAUGHT, SO SIMPLE TO BE LED BY THE NOSE, ASK 1 MALAY WHY HE PROTEST, he will mutter, ‘saya tak tahu, (HERE IS SOME OF THE ANSWERS I GOT YESTERDAY FROM THE CHAMPIONS OF ISLAMIC RIGHTS) – saya ikut kawan, ask the kawan, saya,ikut arahan, arahan dari sapa? lagi satu kawan, kawan ini dari parti mana, saya tak tahu, tapi saya dengar dia kata ada orang cina dan india nak kacau islam, dia orang nak tukar islam, dari agama resmi, malaysia JADI SAYA DATANG NAK PROTES, another jaguh kampung said ‘oh they want to insult islam’ without understanding the issue. THAT IS WHY THE MALAYS WILL REMAIN BODOH FOR THE REST OF ETERNITY, THEY ARE A BUNCH OF MENTAL RETARDS WITH THE IQ OF 0.02, LIKE THE SAYING GOES THE ONE WITH ONE EYE WILL BE KING, THAT IS WHY ALL THE PREVIOUS PM’s have been pseudo-malays, tungku-(thai blood), razak(pariah indon-acheh reject), hussein oon(pseudo malay) mahathir-mamak kuti, bodohihaw, (mongrel mix) no wonder they are clueless. I think the reason y the chinese are intelligent, they have the extra gene, it is called the pig gene, it gives the person intelligence, no wonder the malays will remain morons until they help them selves. to all those pseudo talibans no lifers- grow up pigs.

  129. wits0 says:

    On one hand the System tells people to be proud to be M’sian, on the other it promotes a fascistic State instituted bodies to promote ketuanan based on race and religion.

    Such chutzpah is permissible/viable only in Bolehland, it seems. You can have the cake and eat it too!

    Chutzpah: def.
    1. unmitigated effrontery or impudence; gall.
    2. audacity; nerve.

  130. wandererAUS says:

    Susan,
    Two of my comments were not shown, is there a problem with your blog?
    Just checking.

  131. Ravindran Kunjan says:

    Dear All,

    My comment(23:00:41) says it all. This PKR MP Kulim/lawyer deserves it. As a lawyer, he should know his boundaries of fanaticism & freedom of speech/assembly/expression. He has disgraced the course DSAI is setting to take over on 16 September.

    What a shame. I deplore his action, especially, one who mixes emotion with the law.

    No one is questioning the rights of muslims, Islam but, merely looking into the discrimination of fellow human beings who are an aggrieved party of the unfair decisions based on Article 121(1A) as against Article 11. ( Even not saying Article 121(1A) is biased but merely the interpretation).

    God Bless DSAI, all rational Malaysians, RPK, Dr Osman, informers.

    Malaysia for Malaysians.

    Ravindran Kunjan

  132. shaydflin says:

    Let us do a trade.

    Those who don’t like to leave in this country as most of you say, ok, ok, then the government pays you some compensation and you go out. (If the government can take the Trengganu’s oil royalty, sure the cannot one, Emdey said he is waiting for it)

    The government may ask the world president or whoever responsible for a space in Greenland or Antarctica for all of you to be resettled. Oh, you don’t like that place, ok, ok, np, what about Siberia, the moon, or Jupiter!, Oh you like huh? (Wait, wait, wait our rocket isn’t ready yet, probably 2020 ready lah, u can wait ma).

    You are a kind of breed we would want to see some loyalty. (Not royalty, ma, I mean loyalty, a kind of trust that bound each person to another, hey, your fathers had agreed lo).

    Probably when some of you have been neutralized then probably your former countries would be willing to accept you to return.

    Hey, some of you 100 years ago were in the same boat as the Illegal Indonesian immigrants today. (So be happy lah, don’t complain many many lah)

    Or, if you still want to be here, fine, fine, np. Sign a SD (but don’t give to the Internet lah) saying out loud I won’t kacau you guys, I jahit my mulut and I would live in harmony, I will maintain my Malaysian identity and will drop my race identity forever.

    It is a trade ma, why the cannot?. Sure you the can ones. ha ha ha.

    What a life. Malaysia, Malaysia.

  133. cinta Malaysia says:

    Malaysia can only be strong if our Nation’s very foundation is based on religious tolerance. Unfortunately PKR Zulkifli Noordin is not within the realm of this mentality.

    We in Sabah have many members of the same family of different religious beliefs lives under the same roof!

    We cannot disown our own family members just because he or she is not a muslim just as we cannot disown fellow Malaysians if they are not muslims!

    Just wonder whether people like Zulkifli Noordin and those who protested against the Malaysian Bar council yesterday actually read the Malaysian Constitution!

  134. Anonymous says:

    MJ (22:20:13) :

    As long this stupid blog( http://perakbangkit.blogspot.com/2008/08/ukm-maknanya-universiti-orang-melayu.html) still exist…I don’t think so bro….I’m malay/muslim…..but this racist chants by the perakbangkit.blogspot is too much…..hope that somebody should report this matter to the police.

    polis boleh tangkap blogger yang mencemarkan logo PDRM tapi kenapa tdk nampak mereka tangkap blogger yang memainkan sentimen perkauman… adakah logo polis lebih penting daripada keharmonian negara?

  135. visi 2020 says:

    MJ (22:20:13) :

    As long this stupid blog( http://perakbangkit.blogspot.com/2008/08/ukm-maknanya-universiti-orang-melayu.html) still exist…I don’t think so bro….I’m malay/muslim…..but this racist chants by the perakbangkit.blogspot is too much…..hope that somebody should report this matter to the police.

    polis boleh tangkap blogger yang mencemarkan logo PDRM tapi kenapa tdk nampak mereka tangkap blogger yang memainkan sentimen perkauman… adakah logo polis lebih penting daripada keharmonian negara?

  136. bennyloh says:

    Samuel Goh,
    I love this:
    Samuel Goh Kim Eng (10:21:11) :

    Lord, we want to pray to you above
    For your creations on earth numbering 300
    Who have yet to know you really as God of love
    May they all find your freedom while their blood is red

  137. toyolbuster says:

    If we have people like Zulkifli Noordin going around disrupting public forum instead of participating in it in a cilvilised and democratic manner, then we should rethink about throwing our support to whichever party (in this case PKR) that has given him the platform to promote his form of racism. If they eventually come into power to run the country, I don’t believe that we can expect a better future for us here in Malaysia. How can this be considered a better change when they are already displaying such racist overtone, and till now, none of the PR component parties have publicly condemned or disassociated themselves from this racist.

  138. political observer says:

    Zul is one of the below.

    Asked by DSAI tyo lead the protest so that UMNO does not hijack it and paint DSAI as anti-Malay and lose the PP By-elections. Zul over did the acting he was supposed to do and the script did not call him and his protesters to storm the hall and call all chinese pigs and go home to china. I guess this was a trap laid by UMNO and now all the PP non-malays will be angry and vote BN. Now time for BN to nominate a Non-malay to contest the PP by-elections. all non malays or majority will vote for the non-malay candidate and also the loyal UMNO voters. What a master plan by UMNO to defeat DSAI. Remember Ambiga was also in the UMNO plan. If DSAI loses she will be made a Tan sri and given a judge position. I think the governement should lock zul under ISA and throw away the key. He is a danger to the malaysian public. this is what you get when you send a malay student who just passed thru him SPM with government help to study law on a government scholarship. You ended up having a stupid lawyer and a street thug. DSAI it is your turn now, sack zul now or you will lose the non-malay votes and also the moderate malay votes in PP. Anyhow you can not use zul’s MP vote. He can not vote as he is under ISA. If your PKR MP’s keep doing this and the government then arrest them under ISA , you will be losing all this votes you need to be PM. Sack zul and make in a example before it is too late

    Or

    Zul is a UMNO mole and was activated by him UMNO masters to inflick maximum damage to DSAI standing with non-malays.

    WHICH EVER WAY YOU READ IT , THE DAMAGED TO DSAI HAS ALREADY BEEN DONE. I CAN SAFELY SAY THAT THIS WILL BE BN’S CAMPAINGE ISSE AND DSAI WILL LOSE THE PP BY-ELECTION.

  139. visi 2020;

    it is painful to see our fellow friends have such a mind state. I’m a chinese but i had my long period of my life studying at sekolah haji. without doubt i also have alot of malay/muslim friends and even as my best friend and we don’t see any problem with that. a real malay muslim in my heart is gentle and very very good people, sometimes i do feel that the chinese have more greed than the malay. But thing’s started to to a different state now, some spinning here and there an each races started to hate one another and worst, more and more all for the name of money power and greed but always pretendious to be holy and use the reason of people and religion protector to achieve their goal.

    it is a regret but a true fact that now islam has been spinned by some so called pure muslim and turning it into a empire instead of a religion. I never understand this, in my opinion; a religion is just a guidance to human to lead a harmony and peaceful life and i believe nothing more than that, bible/quran/buddhism all of these is “JUST A GUIDELINE” and many have taken it into something extreme. i always see power and money behind everything. shame!

    my true respect for those fellow friends who practice the real teaching fo islam.

    crash

  140. cancer5330 says:

    Stop testing the patience of our Muslim brothers . I begin to suspect the sincerety of the Bar Council . The government have told them to have the discussion behind closed doors why insist on open discussions . Was it not to test the patience of the Muslims despite the fact that they knew the issue was a sensitive one ? I know their ultimate aim is to ask the government to repeal Article 121 (1A) of the Federal Constitution .In a muti racial and multi religious country like ours we must always be sensitive ot others feelings .

  141. Menyalak-er says:

    Hahaha, shady, you really want to trade? What a gem of ignorance/racism…
    Say what, we true constituitional loyalist to the DYMM YDP Agung, give the ‘loyalist Talibanist/bumno/others’, people like you all the ‘royalties’ of all gas and oil from all of the Malaysian territories x 10yrs for you & your ilk to ‘migrate’ to any uninhabited islands of Micronesia since you so love the idyllic sunsets and coconut trees. Besides you’re all excellent mariners of old.
    Leave the all true nonhypocritical Muslims-Malays & others (which form the majority), loyal babi Chinapek and disadvantaged kutu Indians with us…
    No, we won’t even call you a ‘breed’ but we’ll call you by a more honorific title: ‘Chupzpahs’ as wits0 defined, and you can keep you Malaysian Passport for the next 50yrs.
    But no PR status wiil be accorded. There will be no interference whatsoever with the form of your governance, economy, diplomacy etc.
    Your internet access is free for the rest of your natural life.
    Other ‘niggling’ smallprint can be worked out as negotiations continue.
    Is it a trade, where 2 party’s engage in commerce, you may counter intelligently. Trade is negotiable, talibanization is not.
    Over to you, 10-4.

  142. malayamuda says:

    Article 121[1A] was written by Dr Mahathir not by Allah

  143. james says:

    I am not a BN supporter. Nor am I in support of DSAI’s tactic of grabing power. I dont place much hope on DSAI’s govt. Especially if those MPs from the current ruling BN defect to PKR. A leopard never changes its spots. Those defected will still be practising what they are doing right now before they defect. If DSAI have guts. Call for an election after he take over, drop all the defectors and field new comers.

  144. Displace MIC member says:

    Who started it all Datuk Ambiga.

    1. Her former home is Bukit Damasara ( Millionaire row who are worth 10 to 50 million ) now own by a corrupted minister. Ambiga has now upgraded to a more lavish home for millionaires worth 51 to 100 million.

    2. Ambiga’s law firm has been getting plum goverment contracts in the GLCs

    3. She is a MIC card carring memeber

    4. She is related to samy vellu on his wife’s side. So say she was also his mistress. Samy vellu passes on the contracts from works ministry to her legal firm.

    5. She is very close to the Law Minister and Rais Yatim

    6. She is due for a Tan Sri on the king’ birthday next year.

    7. she arranged this forum to instigate a blacklash from the mulims and then a blacklash by non-mulims to the muslims reaction.

    8. This forum was done with PP by-election in mind. IF DSAI opens his month either supporting the malays or non-malays he will lose support of one of these groups.

    9. Ambiga has been offered a Federal court jugde appointment ones he tenure as bar president ends

    10. Ambiga is also a racist to the core as a membership of MIC will speak off. MIC is a racist party.

    11. She is a very ambitious woman and also a nypominac.

    more to come later but judge her you way and comment on the above

  145. Puan Zack says:

    Salam to all.

    it is unfortunate that Zul Noordin used his MP-blog to post his statement on his dismayal over the forum. truth be told though, he did not act out under the capacity as a PKR-MP, but as an NGO member.

    it is unfortunate that he is now known as an MP first, then an NGO member.

    heard from the grapevine that he got some stern warnings from the PKR office not to go ahead with the demo. alas he still did.

    i am an Allah-fearing practising Muslim… and I do not whatsoever condone the demo against the forum.

    A lot of other Muslims that I know of would agree to this kind of discussion and forum. Ahmad Deedat did all these; and I just know if Prophet Mohamed (pbuh) would still be alive, he would agree to this and would want all of us to sit together and discuss. a ‘muzakarah’.

    Respect is to be gained, NOT to be instilled in such intimidating and terrorizing manner.

    May Allah bless our Malaysia, aaameeen.

    Allahu a’lam.

  146. Menyalak-er says:

    Ah well, this Zul thingy was one of the landmines that will be put in place as the ‘takeover/makeover…’ or whatever u wanna call it continues, as had been warned. This should be put into its proper context, and whatever is meted out to the aforesaid, is just sideplot. In general, the ordinary non-muslims are not very worried about this BAR thing, it is as they expect – what else can they understand? Oppresion mah! Normal thing & even if we scream and howl… absolutely no effect. They are trying to cope with inflation, child-rearing etc.
    PR hasn’t reached the ‘claymore-mine’ filled to the brim with c4 and steel condoms yet. Hope they thread carefully and can avoid it – but the way they’re stumbling around does not augur well…
    As for the rest of the plot, lets not try to 2nd guess, as there are already too many ‘predictions/prophecies/from genius to moronic-level suggestions/other over-seer-ing activities right now.
    Just keep our eyes on the ‘ball’ both sides (always a pair); ok? Humongous comedy soon!
    Regards.

  147. DanielYKL says:

    Just read NST reported that the police deny Zulkifi was detained under ISA

    http://www.nst.com.my/Current_News/NST/Sunday/NewsBreak/20080810155218/Article/index_html

  148. fairplay says:

    oois you mic outsider do not slander ambigaca or DS Samy Vellu. Go and slander your DAP and PKR Indians. Poodah

  149. Menyalak-er says:

    Aiyoyo, now got other red-hotted postmenopausal nymphomaniacs, beside Mdm. Lumpiolus oso-ah…? Hahaha… Interesting and intresting-er.
    See more and more humor, wait for the puchline in this episode.
    Puan Zack, truly a Malaysian, most pleased to meet you! You are the soul of what this nation should be…

  150. Datuk AmbigaDear says:

    Dear Miss Soone.

    Please desist this forum from slandering me. You should desist immediately or my law firm Ambiga , Rais and Richard will serve you a write to sue you for slander and damages for 1 billion ringgit. You have 1 hrs to to aplogise and await your answer on this forum

    Your sincerly

    Datuk Ambiga

  151. better future for all says:

    I thought only PAS has such ignorant, overbearing religious bigots, but in PKR.
    Who is this loud-mouth shit-spitting Zulkifli Noordin think he is?
    Non-Muslims have every right to discuss conversion to Islam, we are dire straits – without judiciary to give us justice, we are judged by syariah courts.
    Look at what they are doing the indigenous people – these people cannot be converted to other religions other than Islam – is this written in the Fed. Constitution. Churches demolished, the people threatened, if not for foreign intervention, these would have escalated.
    they claimed their religion is tolerant – how???

  152. Puan Zack says:

    Hi forum members why all so silent. afraid of a lady who may sue all

  153. iaddada says:

    if you have a sound body and mind and you convert to Islam, it means you decide to hold your responsibility as a Muslim, thus have to live by its rules. Islam is not difficult, but man made it difficult. but as a Muslim you should understand that death is the sentence for apostasy. It’s not easy to convert out of Islam. Understand that, but our society is so kind as to let most people off the hook. Non Muslims should understand that. So Islam is all about justice. this also applies to rasionale thinking Muslims or converts, to also have justice also for their non Muslim families. NOn Muslims should read more about Islam and the Syariah law, before decide something against it. Respect each other religion. Deal with issues regarding your own faith before decde to meddle with other people’s religion. The Bar council should have more discretion and insight about all these things, and not be all gung-ho like a cowboy. Don’t blame others, when you were reckless about this!

  154. Shia muslim says:

    T

  155. Shia muslim says:

    Islam practised by the shia muslims is the true islam. shia do not belief in the sunnah or haridth but only only the word of god the holy koran. shia muslims do not marry 4 wives. Islam practised by the sunnis is false islam as they practise and follow the sunnah and haridth which is man made. Holy koran is the ultimate one and nothing else. If you follow the true islam you as muslims will not be insure at all.

  156. Menyalak-er says:

    Hahaha, Pn Zack – went to cut grass and clean up dog poo.
    How can we apologise to Datuk AmbigaDear, when we ourselves aren’t ‘slandering’ “her”? Now even Susan cannot do anything about this type of ‘slander’, she gets sued if it’s true too.
    Many of us may/may not believe this, we take it in good humor because we do not know what this is all about nor where it comes from. Can’t one laugh to oneself? Must laugh with you?
    Everything nowadays is about sue here and arrest there. Legality has its place, if someone says something ‘un-nice’ or untrue, then counter, rebuke, insult etc. but this is a virtual space, like in your ‘mind’.
    Look see ‘fairplay’, that’s the way to go in cyberspace, but then again we have amateur/immature threats.
    Aiya, very podah like that. Hahaha… anyone for tea?
    It is not about legality, it is about righteousness…

  157. xy says:

    whatever faith one uphold/subscribe to, it comes from the heart, not rules and regulations.

    putting aside whatever labels of each religion, how many true buddhists, christians, muslims are there amongst their own population ?

    Faith comes from the heart, not what our ID indicates.

  158. rock of whiterock island says:

    Wow wow wow, our dearest sloony, trying to diffuse the feud of this Islamic issue?

    Kudos to you for trying your best . Perhaps you have been assigned by the Supreme God of Jade to solve this rancor of Bolehland, ha ha ha ha …..

    Yah! I too pray to the Supreme God of Jade who is the almighty God of all gods. Under the purview of God Of Jade, there are the god of land, god of seas, god of mountains, god of gold, god of money, god of dragons, the monkey god, the three-eyed god, the god of middle east and etc etc….

    This practice of praying to the God of Jade has been flashed back 6,000 years ago. Anybody on earth can choose the god one feels comfortable with.

    There is no rule that one has to believe to one god at one’s entire life. One can change from one god to another one at one’s liking at one’s different time of life.

    So if a god is so cheeky, why stick to that god? Can that god instructs the followers to carry out its order?

    This kind of god is not under the purview of the God of Jade who forbids this weird mantra…..

    It’s against the law of the Sky Kingdom, ah ha ha ha ha… jangan main main ohh, nanti kena baker balu tahu he he he he….

  159. Anonymous says:

    Hey, menyalak, write proper lah, don’t understand your words lah, What, you didn’t pass your SPM huh? , oh IC, in that case never mind lah, write lah whatever you want, nobody cares.

    Ha ha Ha , menyalak, sama macam anjing menyalak, ha ha ha. Ho Ho Ho, merry Christmas,

  160. tzarina says:

    The question: Are you ready for this forum?
    Answer: YOU may not be ready, but the families who are VICTIMS of the current BIASED justice system ARE!!

    Who should matter more?

    Protest of Bar Council Forum: Shamala and Subashini Betrayed by Malaysia

  161. Menyalak-er says:

    Aiya, Anonymous.. how many times oredi i told you, not SPM la, SPR – tingkatan 3. That’s i dog mah… only know how to bow-wowla!
    So stoopid, until nobody who wears underwear understand wat… tats y i very respect those fellos wit masters, doctolates n all tat meh… many brains, no dick! hahaha…
    Btw, Merry X’mas, Happy Chapgomeh, Tanglung Day, Deepavali, Hari Raya etc.
    Arr, friend too many pubic holidays, dulls the mind korek or not!?
    Oh, my friend quatum man xy, u oso very spritual ah – must be, otherwise how to understand all that quanta. Goodwork!

  162. Unhappy God says:

    Fuck you all religious people. God belong to all and not to one partcular religion. Until you all reliaze this only then you all can be better human beiengs. God can fight he or she own battle.

    Stupid dumb people , god must be laughing at us and what clowns we are.

  163. meowcuntcutter says:

    Ya lah itu XY olang XFiles punya, itu hantu tingi mai punya, malam malam bagi tau dia apa mau bikin punya, Lu tak tau kah menyalak? aiyo SPR saja glade 3 lagi aiyo aiyo samy, itu MMR 2 sudah mau jatuh.

  164. Rissa says:

    well, well, I felt blessed in a way after reading all these heated comments here. What is the point of having a religion and ended up fighting among each other.

    I, a free thinker. I don’t have a religion. I believe in myself. My own principles in life is lived a simple healthy life; be a friendly and loving person, no killing, do charity, respect and honour our parents, the elder, the young, the sick & the poor. As long as I keep and live to my principles, I am proud of myself.

    I don’t have enemies from any of the religions.

  165. Edi神 says:

    He deserve it…
    for being a lunatic

  166. Menyalak-er says:

    Oi meowcuntcutter, apala u cakapla? Bukan grd3 spr, takda pass langsung o! Ta’pa kita kawan2 sama bodoh, boleh?
    Apo kena sampai xy? Samiktu saya tau – aiya, itu mrr2 sudah koyak ka? Satu kali tada cukup, macam2 kisah liwat la…
    Eh, sapa itu Rissa ‘freethinker’ ah? meowcuntcutter, lu pi tengok, mana ada lawan2 sini ooo, sini kita semua sama2 cakap2 bodo betul tak?
    Aiya mana lu punya arak, bagi saya la… Besuk i sama u masuk ISA ok?
    Lagi satu, itu org Zul ah – cakap polis bukan ISA pulak, ini fello mesti kena bISA!

  167. koolgeek says:

    zulkifli should be sacked from PKR.

  168. Unhappy God says:

    STOP AND STOP ALL THIS ARUGEMENT IN MY NAME. I NEED NOBODY TO FIGHT FOR ME.

  169. Rissa says:

    Menyalak-er

    Aiya, can anyone translate what Menyalak-er wrote? I really don’t understand his English and Bahasa “Malay”. You drove me Nut!!!

  170. chaptokam says:

    Puan Zack (16:28:13) :

    Hi forum members why all so silent. afraid of a lady who may sue all

    let me get my SD written first ok the tell your lady go fly kite and kiss my ass .

  171. Menyalak-er says:

    Dear Rissa,
    Hahaha, can you understand this? Ok, I’m not speaking either in English nor in Malay, it’s called Palatese… You might want to look up the BM-English dictionary on the word ‘palat’, but don’t hold it against me.
    Please don’t go ‘nuts’, it’s not good for your heart.
    Sometimes when the world is as crazy as this, a little humor does wonders for the soul, assuming that you believe in ‘souls’.
    Susan’s blog is actually one of the very few that entertain such ‘black’ comedy. There are 2 very important views one must never disregard – the very ‘high academic’ English in which i converse in with wits0 and others of his level and the ‘very low’ Manglish or pasar malay as you had just witnessed. I am all things to all men.
    Not many can stomach this, so please read in between the lines for ‘nuggets’.
    Cheers.

  172. chaptokam says:

    Aiyoo what’s so difficult , next time before they proceed with the forum , put a roasted pig in front of the door and see whether they still want to come in !

  173. Khairy Kemulutin says:

    The only religion where a person is born with it!

    Cannot even probed further.

    Once in always in.

    They follow god or what? If follow the prophet, mati lah. All the wrong things this man prophet does they follow mati mati until today. Even wrong ones.

    Dopit.

  174. daryl says:

    Kulim MP
    I think you own the PR an explanation on your remarks. Very disappointing remark since I thought highly of you as one of a moderate Malay Muslim politician. We will be waiting for your explanation because you are responsible for what you said. The rakyat’s paient is really low right now so please don’t test it for something like this. As a MP you represent Malaysian not a segment of the community. Shame on you if you choose not to comment..

  175. Ravindran Kunjan says:

    Dear All,

    My family and I wish Dato’ Seri Anwar Ibrahim a HAPPY, JOYOUS & MEANINGFUL 61ST BIRTHDAY & Congrats ahead of your win in Permatang Pauh.

    The C4 Tee Pee M, PIG Musang & Botak Alba are laughing fits as PKR receive adverse remarks from the rowdy behaviour of the SESAT MP & his so called “jihad” group of intolerant, selfish, violent members.

    I believe the rascist fanatic MP of PKR, has no room in PKR-a multiracial party, should be dragged to the discipline committee for a show cause and duly sacked for his actions. He can join PAS or enrol with the jihad group in the middle east, for ALL I CARE.

    The 13 GE would see PAS left to contest with PKR or DAP & BN; the votes of non malays will go to PKR & DAP. Mind you, Mr MP the total number of non malay voters can swing the votes against you rascist rascals, who, if are that religious as you claim or show off, you should be humble, believe in musyawarah & refrain from attempts to threaten the legitimate citizens of Malaysia with violence, “jihad”, sedition or otherwise. Just see how HINDRAF changed your positions today. Even the RMP gave up! Now that is a mere 10% of those who support the cause you have seen demonstrating. I am a kung fu movie fan, and, I like the chinese saying in the movies, “DO NOT WAKE UP THE SLEEPING DRAGON”.

    Otherwise you guys will be rotting away with your rascists & fanatic thoughts……hoping to bring about change. Just muslims & malays cannot win the GE for PR/PKR/PAS…..or the selfish, rude, naughty, unprofessional MP.

    GOD is everywhere for the Muslims, Christians, Hindus, Budhists, Taoists, etc. If you look at BEIJING 2008 theme “ONE WORLD ONE DREAM” is coming from a super power. What is BOLEHLAND!

    This lawyer is involved in the conversion cases and responsible for the many hardships caused to so many aggrieved parties. The “dosa”/sin is on him.

    One should learn from the good and stop trying to be the hero of a religious cause by being unreligious in the eyes of so many. I believe in my dad’s saying, “Do Not Hurt Anyone! Do Not Steal! Do Not Lie! Do Not Borrow Money! Do Not Tarnish the Family Name!……..NOW, HE IS A HINDU! MY FAMILY & I ARE PROUD TO BE A HINDU & A MALAYSIAN. If that hurts the “unsound” MP & his cohorts can go suck an egg….even which I doubt they know how to do!!!!

    God Bless YAB DSAI, YBhg DSWA, Dr Oman, brave informers & rational Malaysians.

    MALAYSIA FOR MALAYSIANS.

    Ravindran Kunjan.

  176. BEN says:

    BE CAREFULL, DON’T FALL INTO THE DEVILS TRAP, BE AWAKE AND ALERT ALL THE TIME.IT’S THE UMO DEVIL’S WORK. DON’T BE USED BY THEM, BE VERY VERY CAREFULL. SOME ALREADY BEING BOUGHT OVER, DON’T MISTAKEN ‘THE CHANGE TO DEVIL’S’ AS YOUR FRIEND ANY MORE. HUMAN GOT GREED AND WEAKNESSES,CAN BE EASILY BOUGHT OVER. CONCENTRATE ON PERMATANG PAUL AND BE SMART, MAKE SURE OUR BELOVED DSAI WON HANDS DOWN. DON’T FALL INTO THEIR TRAP, THE CORRUPTED UMO ARE TRYING TO MAKE YOU ALL FIGHT EACH OTHER. LONG LIVE RPK AND DSAI. MAY GOD SAVE MALAYSIA.

  177. chaptokam says:

    Declare the Kulim Bandar Bahru seat null and void . Lets see whether you will be re-elected or not Bodoh betul ini pariah punya lawyer . lansung tak guna . Pergi jauh sini beruah .

  178. Has anyone done a research on this?

    (http://message.snopes.com/showthread.php?p=705663)

    Adapted from Dr. Peter Hammond’s book: Slavery, Terrorism and Islam: The Historical Roots and Contemporary Threat

    Also noted by a commentor from Malaysia Today…..

    ISLAM

    Islam is not a religion, nor is it a cult. In its fullest form, it is a complete, total, 100% system of life.

    Islam has religious, legal, political, economic, social, and military components. The religious component is a beard for all of the other components.

    Islamization begins when there are sufficient Muslims in a country to agitate for their religious privileges.

    When politically correct, tolerant, and culturally diverse societies agree to Muslim demands for their religious privileges, some of the other components tend to creep in as well.

    Here’s how it works.

    As long as the Muslim population remains around or under 2% in any given country, they will be for the most part be regarded as a peace-loving minority, and not as a threat to other citizens. This is the case in:

    United States — Muslim 0.6%
    Australia — Muslim 1.5%
    Canada — Muslim 1.9%
    China — Muslim 1.8%
    Italy — Muslim 1.5%
    Norway — Muslim 1.8%

    At 2% to 5%, they begin to proselytize from other ethnic minorities and disaffected groups, often with major recruiting from the jails and among street gangs. This is happening in:

    Denmark — Muslim 2%
    Germany — Muslim 3.7%
    United Kingdom — Muslim 2.7%
    Spain — Muslim 4%
    Thailand — Muslim 4.6%

    From 5% on, they exercise an inordinate influence in proportion to their percentage of the population. For example, they will push for the introduction of halal (clean by Islamic standards) food, thereby securing food preparation jobs for Muslims. They will increase pressure on supermarket chains to feature halal on their shelves — along with threats for failure to comply. This is occurring in:

    France — Muslim 8%
    Philippines — Muslim 5%
    Sweden — Muslim 5%
    Switzerland — Muslim 4.3%
    The Netherlands — Muslim 5.5%
    Trinidad & Tobago — Muslim 5.8%

    At this point, they will work to get the ruling government to allow them to rule themselves (within their ghettos) under Sharia, the Islamic Law. The ultimate goal of Islamists is to establish Sharia law over the entire world.

    When Muslims approach 10% of the population, they tend to increase lawlessness as a means of complaint about their conditions. In Paris , we are already seeing car-burnings. Any non-Muslim action offends Islam, and results in uprisings and threats, such as in Amsterdam , with opposition to Mohammed cartoons and films about Islam. Such tensions are seen daily, particularly in Muslim sections, in:

    Guyana — Muslim 10%
    India — Muslim 13.4%
    Israel — Muslim 16%
    Kenya — Muslim 10%
    Russia — Muslim 15%

    After reaching 20%, nations can expect hair-trigger rioting, jihad militia formations, sporadic killings, and the burnings of Christian churches and Jewish synagogues, such as in:

    Ethiopia — Muslim 32.8%

    At 40%, nations experience widespread massacres, chronic terror attacks, and ongoing militia warfare, such as in:

    Bosnia — Muslim 40%
    Chad — Muslim 53.1%
    Lebanon — Muslim 59.7%

    From 60%, nations experience unfettered persecution of non-believers of all other religions (including non-conforming Muslims), sporadic ethnic cleansing (genocide), use of Sharia Law as a weapon, and Jizya, the tax placed on infidels, such as in:

    Albania — Muslim 70%
    Malaysia — Muslim 60.4%
    Qatar — Muslim 77.5%
    Sudan — Muslim 70%

    After 80%, expect daily intimidation and violent jihad, some State-run ethnic cleansing, and even some genocide, as these nations drive out the infidels, and move toward 100% Muslim, such as has been experienced and in some ways is on-going in:

    Bangladesh — Muslim 83%
    Egypt — Muslim 90%
    Gaza — Muslim 98.7%
    Indonesia — Muslim 86.1%
    Iran — Muslim 98%
    Iraq — Muslim 97%
    Jordan — Muslim 92%
    Morocco — Muslim 98.7%
    Pakistan — Muslim 97%
    Palestine — Muslim 99%
    Syria — Muslim 90%
    Tajikistan — Muslim 90%
    Turkey — Muslim 99.8%
    United Arab Emirates — Muslim 96%

    100% will usher in the peace of ‘Dar-es-Salaam’ — the Islamic House of Peace. Here there’s supposed to be peace, because everybody is a Muslim, the Madrasses are the only schools, and the Koran is the only word, such as in:

    Afghanistan — Muslim 100%
    Saudi Arabia — Muslim 100%
    Somalia — Muslim 100%
    Yemen — Muslim 100%

    Unfortunately, peace is never achieved, as in these 100% states the most radical Muslims intimidate and spew hatred, and satisfy their blood lust by killing less radical Muslims, for a variety of reasons.

    ‘Before I was nine I had learned the basic canon of Arab life. It was me against my brother; me and my brother against our father; my family against my cousins and the clan; the clan against the tribe; the tribe against the world, and all of us against the infidel. — Leon Uris, ‘The Haj’

    It is important to understand that in some countries, with well under 100% Muslim populations, such as France, the minority Muslim populations live in ghettos, within which they are 100% Muslim, and within which they live by Sharia Law. The national police do not even enter these ghettos. There are no national courts, nor schools, nor non-Muslim religious facilities. In such situations, Muslims do not integrate into the community at large. The children attend madrasses. They learn only the Koran. To even associate with an infidel is a crime punishable with death. Therefore, in some areas of certain nations, Muslim Imams and extremists exercise more power than the national average would indicate.

    Today’s 1.5 billion Muslims make up 22% of the world’s population. But their birth rates dwarf the birth rates of Christians, Hindus, Buddhists, Jews, and all other believers. Muslims will exceed 50% of the world’s population by the end of this century.

    Adapted from Dr. Peter Hammond’s book: Slavery, Terrorism and Islam: The Historical Roots and Contemporary Threat

  179. suiside69 says:

    Zulkifli Noordin lack of interlectual knowledge about his owned religion “Malu betul”. How can he understand and feel about about other religious belief.
    Nak tunjuk his leadership quality tak kena tempat. Bodoh macam lembu.
    I hope PKR will take disciplinary action against him ASAP.
    My relatives in Kulim vote for PKR . We hope Zul will be vaporize as MP soon. Lousy leader… Lembu.

  180. chief justice of malaya says:

    As long as human beings are still around, there will be different interpretations and interruptions by different creative human beings. This is the main reason why when all religions have only ONE saying, but when it comes to the minds of different people, some of them tried so hard to outsmart the original saying.

  181. Menyalak-er says:

    Freedom & Justice, very good work.
    I have read this a while back, and it’s no longer a hypothesis but has evolved into a full blooded theory (can someone else please explain the diff., malas++), that is taught as a subject in many Humanities/Social Science courses throuhout the world.
    Of course there will be a hue and cry here, once the ‘behinders’ get a whiff of it and will be countered by other imaginative hypotheses.
    But hey, who are we to judge… ‘ignorami’ that we are.
    Btw, a very appropriate quote too from Leon Uris’s “The Haj”, a classic, (as is “Exodus”). ‘Tribal thinking’ and all that, but a good eye-opener for many not so ‘malas’ people to read. Deepens our perception…

  182. wits0 says:

    Menyalak-er, when the gloriously ‘patriotic’ Gomen killed the English medium of education, it also paralyzed also the reading skill and dragged much knowledge of the world of literature under a torporic tempurong. All in the cause of the tribal nationalism of hubris. MahaKutty furthermore promoted that so-called “Eastern values” that condemns individualism and glorified herdish feudalism. What can be expected from perverted values?

  183. taliban bodoh says:

    SUSAN GO AND READ THIS
    http://www.bernama.com/bernama/v5/newsindex.php?id=351898
    oNE OF THE POLICEMEN BEING INVESTIGATED for the stolen $1million worth of drugs executed by somebody, he was shot in the head and the other three who were being the culprits were rearrested. so police also executing their own machai, this is like the mafia. Now police also drugpushers, thiefs, executors mafia style, wait a minute, weren’t the two guys in the c4 case also from police force-malaysian-police-secret-service-utk. they are now showing their true colours and the majority of them , aren’t they muslim malays, SO DON’T THESE MUSLIMS BELIEVE IN ALLAH?

  184. Half Malay says:

    U want us “non” pure Malay-sians to balik? Sure… put me on the next plane with Nori to my right and Kamal on my left…..Fools!

  185. souse says:

    ZUL RESIGN AS MP.

  186. souse says:

    Zulkifli Nordin is sodomising his ignorant muslim bradders like blogger mahaguru:

    No, this ‘Babi’ will Not ‘Balik Cina’
    By Farish A. Noor
    http://blog.limkitsiang.com/2008/08/11/no-this-babi-will-not-balik-cina/

  187. rajes says:

    This protesting Pakatan muslims all got no shame when they proudly send their mualims to the babi in Beijing.
    Recall the bloody muslims instead of hanging around with pigs. Anyway the pigs will get more medals than these useless pious muslims.

  188. rajes says:

    HAHAHA that stupido idiot Bush call it religion of peace

  189. Pisa says:

    7.18pm update: Police has denied he is detained under the ISA. It was a rumour probably started by “irresponsible” people, said Deputy IGP Tan Sri Ismail Omar (Bernama).
    ___________________________________________________________________

    The person who started the rumor was “irresponsible” blogger Mahaguru58 who said he received a phone call from the Kulim MP.
    Does Deputy IGP Tan Sri Ismail Omar have the guts to investigate his brother muslim? Or does the DGIP agree with Kulim MP?

  190. razifadzil says:

    What the hell is going on now..

  191. kittykat46 says:

    I’m not surprised at all with the behaviour of the UMNOputras, but very disappointed with Zulkifli Noordin.

    His constituency includes a substantial town, Kulim, and the adjoining Kulim High-Tech Park and Kulim Industrial Estate. The non-Muslim community in Kulim voted heavily for PKR in GE12 because of Anwar Ibrahim’s inclusive message.

    Did Zulkifli Noordin sound inclusive at the forum incident ? Nope…he was trying to out-do the UMNOputras.

    If Kulim ends up as another by-election as a result of the on-going election petition, I think a lot of Chinese and Indians will just not bother to vote, with a choice between UMNO and just another UMNO-clone from PKR.

    Anwar Ibrahim cannot afford to keep quiet on what happened to the forum, its going to be an election issue at Permatang Pauh. I wonder how he dances around this one….

  192. wits0 says:

    On another note, Rais vs Rice over Anwar:

    “…US Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice said the US would never stop speaking on human rights and political cases while Foreign Minister Rais Yatim accused the US of meddling in Malaysia’s domestic affairs…”
    http://www.todayonline.com/articles/266967.asp

    If so called, ‘Domestic Affairs’ factor trumps everything else, might as well demolish all Human Rights Agencies around the world! The irony also is that Rais seek to explain to the UN it’s “justification”.

    Even before reading/re-reading(for many)that the below on the The Universal Declaration of Human Rights, it is clear to many that M’sia is amongst the some 57 countries that have not lived up to it in terms of freedom of religion as well:
    http://tinyurl.com/6y46lw

    We have expected better from M’sia, but hell no!

    So it becomes ludicrous, what this diapered Rais is now pursuing in seek of ‘justification’, trying to explain to UN and foreigners.

  193. Anonymous says:

    chaptokam (19:49:14) :

    “Puan Zack (16:28:13) ,
    let me get my SD written first ok the tell your lady go fly kite and kiss my ass .”

    once more sampah sarap Malaysia called chaptokam tried to bully the ladies. Some more asking the ladies to kiss his ass. sampah sarap Malaysia called chaptokam rubbished about his religious behaviour when he ran out of arguments. with this kind of BN supporter/cybertrooper(this kind of standard and behaviour) like sampah sarap Malaysia called chaptokam, the step down of BN government is not going to surprise the international communities.

  194. NZGayman says:

    Cleptoclam’s true colours are coming out in the open.
    Good. Now we know who we are dealing with.

    Not much different from my favourite target, Booby Kiwi.

  195. wits0 says:

    Kittykat, ” I wonder how he dances around this one…. ”
    So do I. So far only this from PKR:
    PKR mulls action against protest leader Zulkifli
    http://tinyurl.com/6s639z

    Well, don’t take too long…

  196. amoker says:

    Zul should apologize or resign.

    Anyway menyalak-er, i like your ID name.

  197. george says:

    the whole incident can be handle if:

    1) BN government has not failed to get the rakyat united and share and exchange of talk on aspect such as race, religion,… in a fair manner but always show a very defensive look once poke.

    2) Bar Council should have think and plan well prior organising such forum…knowing that some morons/extremists that support for “ketuanan Islam” a chance to create unrest and chaos on the street to protest and intruder into the forum…

    3) Our muslims bro and sis should have inform and prepare for such forum and openly get themselves involve in contribute rather shielding themselves under the constitution which was well spelled out the position.

    4) Police just did not do anything, merely being observer and opportunist to wait for disaster to happen…

    Let not forget that our country is multi racial and religions… pls be tolerate and respect each others… 50 years are enough and do we all want to go backward for another 50 years??? Pls be mature and think globally now…

    Let’s look at Beijing Olmypic theme “ONE WORLD ONE DREAM”… and look at how many ethics groups have in China… 56… they remain unify under 1 nation… and show how strong… as compare with our country…”Malaysia Bolehland”… we are nothing… Vision 2020 is just around the corner and it is not hard to think that we are toward a impossible dream if we keep on fight among ourselves… for the sake of nation…

  198. xy says:

    the virus that causes SARS does not kill the patient. It is the over-reaction of the body’s self-defense system that causes destruction of the lung tissues and the patient eventually died from drowning.

    a machinery that has run a country for decades and has deep control on all its key governing apparatus, will activate its self-defense system when under attack, to ensure its very survival. There might even an over-reaction, in which the real sufferers will be the masses and the nation.

  199. rasta says:

    One day Hamid albar will pay for the sins of his father – like Najis Tun Razak.

  200. gilababi says:

    This gila babi has been pangganed, chopped into keping2. and feed to hungry hantu……

  201. drat says:

    If this moron don`t letak jawatan, he is really very kurang ajar. His parents too mus have been kurang ajar for bringing up this misfit.
    Pariah resign lah apa lagi mahu fikir.

  202. Meyalak-er says:

    I think all the comments so far have been weighed well, and just one observation that wits0 brought up – that needs elaboration.
    Yes, its about the standard of our education system or rather its lack.
    You might want to curse us for being Anglophiles, but truly if there had been an extension of English as the ‘lingua fraca’/medium of instruction as in India, our citizens would have been much better educated and would not have resorted to such ‘depraved’ uncouth, rancorous behavior, more akin to screaming dervishes.
    The need for ‘nationalism’ through frequently misguided changes in the education system, has wrought havoc to our younger generations, whatmore to those leaders, who persistently insult our intelligence in their Manglish.
    Unity requires a medium of communication that is common to all.
    Instead, this nation is going down the drain because of disingenious use of words like “babi, kuttu, ular, pendatang, pengkhianat etc.” which was never uttered at all in the early 60’s-70’s, before the May 13th incident.
    This ‘ketuanan’ incident has made us cower in fear, until a new generation of Onn Jaffars’ materializes.
    That is who Anwar Ibrahim, aspires to be – and thus the present ‘incoherence’ of today. Whether he succeeds or not depends very much on us, the unsung, unpaid true patriots.
    Act wisely, and don’t menyalak unnecessarily in times of trial, and bite only in absolute self defence.

  203. trieste says:

    Yeah, this Zulkifli bloke is not well educated.

  204. rizal says:

    Very simple. That MB Perak pun had to say sorry to the singhs in Perak.
    Zul should be sack. That will be a lesson to others.

  205. puspawangi says:

    What happened to us?????

    After all this years of living together in “perfect harmony”, multi racial, multi cultural, mullti religous etc etc country we are actually not ‘living together”? that we are actually waiting to kill each other, that we really do not want to understand each other? that our MERDEKA is for nothing? is that what some of us trying to tell us?

    i told my daughter that all this bad thing happened because everyone of us fail to be what we are supposed to be. We fail to be a goood Malay or a good Muslim, some failed to be a good Chinese, Indians or Buddhist or Hindu or Christians. If everyone of us follow the good teachings of one choosen faith then maybe all this hatred, misunderstanding, racial or religous slur wont happen..Why dont we realised that we have to live together in Malaysia and the choice on how to live together is in our hand.

    Do we want to live peacefully, without sacrifycing of our realigous or racial principles or do we want to kill each other and destroy our home land. How to live together peacefullly? We need to have a good leader . But do we have any good leader now? because it looks like that our country is in a BIG MESS! and if we are honest , it looks like all the present leaders are not good.

    So how do we explain to our kids the future generation of this country. in the spirit of coming 51th merdeka celebration that there will be a proper country for them when they grow up? not a destroyed land..

    For 50 years we proud ourself to be a fast developed multi racial society that live in harmony when in fact..we dont want to share this country and we hate each other because power and greed has taken over us.

    What do we tell our children, what can they inherit from us? Lies and hatred?

  206. wits0 says:

    Menyalak-er: “Unity requires a medium of communication that is common to all.”

    Also, in a multi-racial society it simply cannot succeed with a medium that clearly exudes unabashedly the purpose favoring the hegemony of one community over another.

    In 4 decades we see a lessening of unity because of this wrong ideology as a result. You can have one national language but not as the means to push for the hegemony of one community. Therefore we see countries with the wisdom of having more than one official language – like India, Canada and Switzerland, e.g. Have they become less united on that account. No, I don’t think so but I(and I’m sure that many perceptive people do as well) that it is the racist hubris behind umno leadership that pretends otherwise.

    MCA was the abetting dawg in this matter. From the beginning it was too lazy to be engaged in proper politics for the masses. It chose people like Tan Cheng Lock and his son Tan Siew Sin who were Baba Anglophiles, not even able to speak Chinese. Much as we disliked about Tan Siew Siew as finance minister(for overly taxing mostly all imports under the pesumption of being ‘luxury goods), he was a straight man wrt his job and had the country in his heart and mind. No so the umno power-that-be(was). He died a grouchy man, lttle moaned and hardly remembered. Limbo sorta in a way.

    MCA thought and pretend that by defending Chinese education, that they are holding the fort. It’s a sick presumption from the start, a pathetic copy of umno race politics to this day and failing badly. Besides, by pretending to be pure cultural ‘Chinese’, you know, non-banana sort, how good is the real quality of Chinese education? It’s not high. Nor can you go far with BM alone in this world.

  207. kittykat46 says:

    Yes, MCA has been a lap-dog for so long, it doesn’t know how to play any other role. It thought the role it had taken up as “Defender of Chinese education” gave it an indispensable place in the community. It’s suddenly found itself very dispensable.

    The current “rebranding” is just a cosmetic PR exercise, doomed to futility.

  208. Meyalak-er says:

    Absolutely, wits0, kittykat and friends.
    Unmentionable Chinese-based ghost party had only one function – to propogate the ‘divide & rule’ stategy via the use of one instrument of Chinese reverance – Education.
    Its other functions if viewed in proper light of day, was pandering to bumno’s lusts.
    The legacy, if it can be called that, of Cheng Lock and Siew Sin, the babas are no longer cherished nor will be remembered.
    Now all we have, is a bunch of goons waging ‘internal’ warfare and committing ‘sepukku, hara-kiri’. Good riddance.
    How do we proceed now that the educational systems are so diverse and irreconcileable? I don’t think it will be possible if this present form of ‘governance’ continues.
    I doubt too that dsai/PR can do anything immediately to resolve this, and it may have to take at least one generation before this horrendous ‘misadventure’ can be corrected. The problem Is: Where’s the will?
    The Judiciary and even the racial problem can be solved albeit with some difficulty.
    Education and the return to the proper singular use of a universal language of commerce, science and technology? Let us not hold our breath.

  209. Ravindran Kunjan says:

    Dear All,

    The rascist, fanatic MP Kulim has dissappeared(according to PKR MPs Tian Chua & Gwo Burne); another “dalang” probabbly now a cohort of umnoputras/bn working with PDRM PIG Musang to “topple” DSAI.

    The PKR MPs have also asked that he be referred to the disciplinary board for action/sacking. Even Dr Syed Husin Ali says he does not agree with Violent/Racist “not so lawyer like” MP who barged into a closed door meeting.

    Another “VANISHING ACT” of a key player, in this case, against PKR/PR but pro umnoputras/bn/pdrm.

    Is he under police protection, too….just like Si Fool?

    What a shame! The few Malay PKR MPs/Adun do not respect the Non Malays & their rights if it is related to religion – they do not believe in constructive discussion but tend to be VIOLENT; earlier in Petaling Jaya Loh Gwo Burne was punched by the PA to MB Selangor, remember over a surau issue. Now this.

    Shameful! When it is GE12 they want the NONs to vote but when refuse to budge on however discriminative a law, issue is in the matter of religion, “ketuanan(caste system of malaysia)”, temple destruction, etc.

    They may be wolves in sheep “skin clothing”……..how sad when we want reformation; a two party system; DSAI as PM, eradication of corruption; independent judiciary; IPCMC to check PDRM; Malaysia for Malaysians.

    Ravindran Kunjan.

  210. SameSame says:

    I thought I smelt a rat with this Zul fella.

    He is another BN-UMNO bought over lah.

    Tsk tsk tsk….only ‘they’ can do this and stand behind the ‘I am a Muslim and I can do whatever..I can swear on my holy book”

    Sorry my muslim friends…but there are some very very tolerant ones..not these goons.

  211. kittykat46 says:

    Apparently, the PKR leadership has not been able to get in touch with him for two days now.

    His blog hasn’t been updated since Saturday, but someone is still administering the comments moderation.

    http://zul4kulim.blogspot.com/

    I won’t be surprised if he re-emerges freshly minted as an UMNO supporter.
    Maybe Step 1, declares himself as an “Independent” MP.

    Perhaps just to show Anwar both sides can play the game of frogs ?

  212. smile says:

    Anyone remember this exchange in Parliament last year when Karpal Singh cornered Home Minister Radzi Sheikh Ahmad into agreeing that Malaysia is not an Islamic state.

    Karpal: In the Constitution, Islam is the official religion and nowhere is it stated that Malaysia is an Islamic state. Right?

    Radzi: Yes, the Constitution says that Islam is the religion of the federation.

    Karpal: That’s all that it is. It is the main religion and nowhere is it stated that Malaysia is an Islamic state. Right?

    Radzi: I agree with you. Karpal: Nowhere in the Constitution is it stated that Malaysia is an Islamic state. Do you agree?

    Radzi: Yes, I agree.

    Karpal: Cukup!

    Checkmate?

  213. smile says:

    Even that malay got more brains than MCA and Lin Lion Sik who say malaysia is an islamic state (in 2001) agreeing with mahathir.
    It is mainly because of MCA that these problems are now taking place.

  214. Hameed Kasseem says:

    Zulkifli Nordin, bila hang nak pi join umno…??? Pasti nanti pilihanraya akan datang nanti…kita orang takkan sokong kat hang yang cetek ilmu !! Hang, kalau baguih patut join forum, beri pandangan dan berbincang secara rasional…bukannya menyalak macam anjing.

    Tengok sekarang nie, banyak orang pandang serong kat hang dan Islam macam agak agresif.

    Buang undi aku jer vote kat hang, sekarang nie, kaler hang pun keluar (your true colours showing). menyesal kita orang sokong hang …perrghh…podah !!

  215. rajes says:

    This self-styled defender of Islam in a green and white Malay Student Front (GPMS) shirt stormed the Bar Council auditorium today to disrupt a forum on religious conversion. (Pix: mkini)

    “I represent Umno. Stop this forum” “Don’t insult Islam” and “You! Chinese, Indians, go to hell!” he shouted, reported malaysiakini. His parents must have been ashamed of him when he was born as he could only identify himself as “Jais”.

    Police found two bottles of alcohol outside the building and it’s believed they were to be used as firebombs.
    PKR’s Kulim Bandar Baharu MP Zulkifli Noordin disgraced himself and the party he claimed he was not representing by behaving like a drunk sailor talking bull.
    http://politics101malaysia.blogsome.com/2008/08/09/p2102/

    So what to do with the Kulim jihadist?

  216. kittykat46 says:

    It seems the PKR leadership has not been able to contact Zulkifli Noordin for a couple of days now.
    His blog has not been updated since Saturday.

    I won’t be surprised if he morphs into an UMNO operative soon.
    Maybe with a short stint as an “Independent” MP in between, just as a fig-leaf.

  217. data says:

    The main thing that just irks me is how all the BN leaders behave as though the whole issue was the Bar Council’s fault. They keep castigating the Bar Council and by extension, the non-Muslims, for “stoking the flames of disunity” as two-time loser Pirdaus Ismail said. That same loser also tried to invoke the lame old charge of being “used by foreign powers who want to create chaos and intervene in the country’s internal affairs”. Najib and Syed Hamid Albar contributed to the hot air by placing the blame on the Bar Council. Shouldn’t those misbehaving morons be the ones to blame? How come no leader has the balls to castigate the moronic mindless mob? Your police water cannonned, tear gassed and beat the HINDRAF protesters but actually escorted the 5 clowns into the Bar Council building so that they could disrupt a civil forum. Why?
    http://joshbeh.blogspot.com/2008/08/go-to-hell.html

  218. wits0 says:

    Najib and Syed Hamid Albar actually made it more clear that the whole thing was an umno machination.

    They might as well declare that in rapes, e.g., the victims are guilty, not the rapists.

  219. styx says:

    Herald gets show cause letter
    http://www1.malaysiakini.com/news/87604

    Whatabout muslim publications like harakah that abuse other religions.
    Its ok for muslims to do it.

  220. chaptokam says:

    Meyalak-er (14:53:30) :

    Absolutely, wits0, kittykat and friends.

    Now all we have, is a bunch of goons waging ‘internal’ warfare and committing ’sepukku, hara-kiri’. Good riddance.

    A Phoenix will rise from the ashes . I share the same concerns as you all . You need to raze the forests filled with unwanted scrubs and trees before you can plant new trees . Guess all of us will have to bear the current pain before we reap the our vision . All of us are taking different paths but they all lead to the same place . There’s simply to much mega problems right now but we need to have preserverance . For every calamity there’s an opportunity .

    I hope I can be a media to channel all your aspirations and views in three months time and to play a meaningful role to correct what is wrong . God Willing .

  221. chief justice of malaya says:

    Tens of thousands of people , muslim and non muslim trained in China ,voluntarily and happily to stage the century’s most spectacular Olympic Game. They show their wisdom , strength and power in a constructive approach.
    They earn substantial support by positive and productive performance.

    What happen to our Malaysian muslim and non muslim, are they moving forward in a constructive manner? For God’s sake, can Malaysians after 51 years of independence, be more united to resolve our challenges right in front of us?

    Can we equip ourselve with better knowledge and skill to help our beloved country to make us more productive, more creative and more innovative , which will help all of us to achieve a better standard of living, better per capital GDP?

  222. Menyalak-er says:

    Again, chaps, old chap, i don’t believe in mythical creatures like Phoenixes. The proper idea, mind you, is little birds (dinosaurs?) darting into a bush fire and plucking out morsels of cooked bugs.
    Is that what the unmentionable party of yours is doing and envisioning?
    Oh well, just as well – cooked birds are easier to pluck!
    No, all roads do not lead to ‘someplace’ – most roads lead to that stinking swamp called Putrajaya! Or to hell, whatever.
    Only one road leads to honesty, righteousness, integrity, reality and peace.
    That is why most of us are pissed off with that cretinous Zul Idiot… He cannot see nor understand! Is not your ‘phoenix’ a creature like that?
    Might take you a while to figure out, but try your best…
    Cheers.

  223. wits0 says:

    ” For God’s sake, can Malaysians after 51 years of independence, be more united to resolve our challenges right in front of us?”

    No, umno being the reason for the shenanigan that really began after the first 7 – 10 years after ’57. During the Indonesian Confrontation, the nation was the most united. The people believed then but umno gnawed that away after that over time leaving hot airs and empty slogans.

  224. hutchrun says:

    Non-Malays living in the vicinity of mosques in Kuala Lumpur hear this call to arms against the non-Muslims through high-pitches megaphones often enough to be dismissed as untrue. I suspect Dr Yusof is annoyed a Muslim has spilled the beans; if a non-Muslim had done so, he could be ignored. Perhaps Dr Yusof should also tell us if Christmas carols mentioning Jesus should be banned at a Christmas party organised by the government. Was there a ban? Of course there was.

    AND

    Dato’ Seri Najib kicked the ball first to insist none should openly debate if Muslims could slander the followers of other religions

    -MggPillai

  225. george says:

    If all hell going down to drain… what the purpose for us (the non muslim and non malay) to take about RT or being a good citizen in Malaysia… or ever unity… well… we can have a war then…

    But think wisely again and again, my gut feeling tell me that this cannot be happen again… like the 513 incident, and someone who is extremist is aggregrating the heat to that extend… Wait a minute…we the Rakyat should not fall stupidly into this kind of trap and to distort the unity among all races and harmony… we should look into this issue as a challenge to get ourselves free from this colonisation of 51 years of BN UMNO…

    Let the Rakyat decide our nation future…let all races to sit down and agree to steer the nation out of this sickening idealogy of BN UMNO… Let all live happy and stay closer under 1 roof… shall us have a better behave and discipline MP, ADUN, DPM & PM to represent us and guide the nation with a sense of fairness and dignity. Let us the Rakyat play our part in continuing the building into a great nation…

    It’s not a dream, my Rakyat, bro & sis…of all races, we should start to do it now… this is reality and we need to work towards this…

  226. smite says:

    Only thing good about RT is next day ponteng kerja.
    Only thing good about NS is it keeps popn level down. (that according to najis).

  227. EEEjam says:

    Maybe Ezam can take advantage of the 16-25 August 2008 Permatang Pauh by-election campaign (no more campaigning allowed on Polling Day) to explain what happened to the ‘six boxes’ of evidence he has hidden that proves almost everyone in Umno and Barisan Nasional are corrupted. He can also explain why his mother took an oath in the name of Allah and declared it haram for any member of her family to join or rejoin Umno. And while he is at it, he can also explain the sumpah keramat or sacred oath that he took where he swore he would never rejoin Umno even if he died and was reborn.

    http://us2.malaysia-today.net/2008/content/view/11233/84/#jc_writeComment

  228. Kherry Scarry says:

    Even murderers will swear that they never kill !!! Sumpah….

  229. chaptokam says:

    Menyalak-er (18:54:33) :
    That is why most of us are pissed off with that cretinous Zul Idiot… He cannot see nor understand! Is not your ‘phoenix’ a creature like that?
    Might take you a while to figure out, but try your best…

    Worst that creature went to New Zealand to study in 82-86 . Guess financed by who ? Chinese tax payers ! I thought he was educated in one of these countries Afganistan , Egypt , Syria or Jordan . But no in New Zealand ! can you imagine that ? A-Levels in Pakuranga College, Bucklands Beach, Auckland and Victoria University of Wellington, New Zealand in 1982-1986. I am just as pissed off as you fellas .
    My phoenix is a very pious man , when the time comes you’ll know . I have known him for almost two decades . You tell me when the time comes , probably you might know him .
    cheers old friend !

  230. Ravindran Kunjan says:

    Dear All,

    The racist chaptokam is again in his top form vulgarity and racism…….claiming that only chinese tax payers paid for MP Kulim’s education in NZ……..Ha!Ha! an umnoputra/bn goon trying his luck to chat away.

    Go ahead you vulgar idiot……you are no better, but, similarly of the same tiny tit pee brains of Zul Kulim…….you rascal.

    Ravindran Kunjan

  231. wits0 says:

    Truly NIAMAH!!!

    “..I read from The Star today that PKR is expected to discuss action to be taken against its Kulim-Bandar Baharu MP Zulkifli Noordin for his behaviour. Discuss action???!!! What’s to discuss? It’s all there in the open. Fire his ass!!! Huh? Oh sorry…wrong geographical location….”

    http://tinyurl.com/674lr5

  232. Menyalak-er says:

    Hahaha… Ravindran K., you very ‘chun’!
    I like the word ‘rascal’ actually… my old English teacher had a different meaning for it though. He didn’t see it as merely ‘naughty’, it was accompanied by ‘perversion and persecution’.
    I think chaptokam, is not bumno, but a very stubborn, narrow minded Sinophile (aka ‘unmentionable’ party-man) who pretends to be magnamious but mired in materialism and apartheid ideation.
    He doesn’t understand the true meaning of Malaysia Malaysian. That’s where your attack should be aimed, Ravindran. Go educate him.
    Regards.

  233. chaptokam says:

    Menyalak-er (17:02:21) :

    He doesn’t understand the true meaning of Malaysia Malaysian. That’s where your attack should be aimed, Ravindran. Go educate him.

    Ravi what are you waiting for ?? Come on I am waiting .

  234. Menyalak-er says:

    Hey wits0, don’t get your Niamah out of joint. Kittykat is right about Zul Idiot jumping; will this be the first salvo? PKR is whupped on this.

  235. wits0 says:

    It was an umno operation Barbarossa all along. A major one. Look at all the big guns spewing forth afterwards. Clue enough. Patrick is also correct, fire him.

  236. wits0 says:

    Menyalak-er, because PKR is whupped on this, don’t attempt disciplinary action and waste ammo, giving him a chance to declare, “I quit!”. Just tell him, “You’re fired!”

  237. Menyalak-er says:

    Yes, pre-empt any funnies who step outta line. Only thing though, if this fig leaf (kittykat’s term) changes, then PR will no longer have any qualms about kataks on 916, u see?

  238. busker says:

    Zulkifli Noordin conned the Kulim Chinese full scale:

    The Kuala Lumpur and Selangor Chinese Assembly Hall (KLSCAH) has issued a public statement calling on the voters of the Kulim Bandar Baharu (P.18) parliamentary constituency in Kedah not to support BN candidate Abdul Aziz Sheikh Fadzir for the latter ‘s role as a leader of an Umno Youth mob that threatened to raze the building of the Hall to the ground and also for screaming anti-Chinese slogans in 2000. Contesting against Abdul Aziz Sheikh Fadzir is PKR’s Zulkifli Noordin.

  239. busker says:

    I duno what that smiley doing there. I keyed in “P.18 parliamentary…”

  240. wits0 says:

    In this particular case though, it looks like PR already has no choice. It can’t appear to be at cross-purpose wrt what it is meant to stand for.

  241. Ravindran Kunjan says:

    Dear All,

    Chaptokam (17:09:03) don’t worry…….. just come out with your racist stupidity and rascalism in disrespect, coupled with vulgarity……..not only will you be “crushed” and made to eat your own words, BUT, disgraced…….you good for nothing disruptor/destroyer of peace, racial harmony and a Malaysian race.

    Go on show your WICKED, RACIST, VULGAR SKILLS as it reflects your up bringing, educated level, immaturity and irrational attack to incite “religious & racial” issues to destroy the PR hopes.

    I am waiting……racist, corrupt, vulgar, brainless umnoputra/bn goon…you rascal you.

    God bless all rational malaysians.

    Ravindran Kunjan

  242. Menyalak-er says:

    This Zul Idiot, is not a Norplant (implantable subcutaneous contraceptive) for nothing, ‘busker’. Conned? i think its worse than that: it’s treachery.
    But then what can we expect, from the ‘behinders’.
    Well, wits0 lets wait and see…

  243. Rissa says:

    You guys here are really boring!!!

  244. Yunnie says:

    Hi Rissa, you are right, Boring!! hahaha. Now go back to your study. This blog is not for you lah.

  245. loo seow pek says:

    Ravindran Kunjanachi Minachi

    tapong , tapong , bunyi drum , tak untong, tak untong , tong tong tong cha ,
    cepat sway you punya bontut , ah ya pandai , sekarang lompat tinggi sikit , ha ya pandai , ini lah menari monyet . wow you pandai menari eh boleh ajar saya ke ???

  246. klse says:

    loo seow pek maira nandri kattan nahin poondah mona.

  247. chaptokam says:

    Hey Ravi

    You got new name eh ! Ravindran Kunjanachi Minachi , nice name , should be Ravindran Kunjanachi Minachi maira nandri kattan nahin poondah mona na vuluk

    heheheheheh , nice name , must ask my Indian friend what it means !

  248. loo seow pek says:

    Ravindran Kunjanachi Minachi thi mah roj apni mori bachdhiya kanjri dha kam karthi
    Ravindran Kunjanachi Minachi maira nandri kattan nahin poondah mona.

    lol !!! apa ini mambo jampo !! elo elo mambo jampo ravi kunja minachi .

  249. puspawangi says:

    alamak its really getting impossible to understand some of the “master piece” posted here Susan…

    so we agreed zulkifli nordin is a mole? did he deliberately blow his cover ?
    because if we check all the sundays newspaper (unless i read last two weeks sundays’s newspaper) there’s no mention anywhere of zulkifli’s being at the BAR Council forum..anybody? i read sinaran, berita minggu, migguan malaysia and metro ahad.

    if he was, remember what he said when he pull out of the altantuya’s muder trial?? too many disturbing hands or something like that..whatever did he mean?

    is he really missing or
    missing ala Bala?

    wah ..sounds like a rap lyric?????

    sometimes its too hard to think rationally and feel much easier to let go..hoping things will be allright one day…that we will celebrate raya, chinese new year, deepavali, Xmas and all other celebrations and go to open houses just like before..just like before..before Anwar being whacked and left to die on his cell floor by our IGP…Impossible?

    I love malaysia. Malaysia to me means all citizens regardless of colors, race, religions, faith..because when i was born they were already my parents neighbours, they were already having grocery shops in my kampung, my friends in class during my school days, varsity days,when i started my career and at this moment when i am writing this piece they were part of my life..and really am looking forward to see them for a reunion at the end of august..so …i am really sad and scared of what to become of malaysia if this hatred and misunderstanding and abused of power to continue…especially after reading some of the things posted in blogs including yours Susan..some were very abusive, bias and prejudice..but then truth sometimes is harsh…reality is hard to accept.

    Lets work together for a better malaysia for everybody. Impossible?

  250. Ravindran Kunjan says:

    Dear All,

    Sold Souls to flip flop devils – Chaptokam & Loo Seow Pek’s umnoputra/bn pornographic & vulgarity is deemed the best that they can do…… go ahead I want somemore…..disgraced lot!!!!!! MY TOES ARE LAUGHING AT YOUR STUPID PORNO JOKES! haha

    We will respect those that respect! Trust only who beget trust! We will defend to death one’s right of opinion, though we disagree with the opinion- Voltaire.

    We shall not stoop so low as these two rascals, who, assume that their vulgarity & pornographic ways are amusing to all….. it only reflects their stupidity and their origin, biro tatanegara school of thought. Teachers include C4 SEX Maniac ERASER; EX DRUNKEN Pinching waitresses backside MINISTER with cigar in mouth; flip flop who married Maid of Putrajaya.

    Come on Chaptokam & Loo Seow Pek rascals, is that the best you can do? Why not perform like your ancestor CHUA Sway Lok, who, as Minister of Health, was also a highly paid VIAGRA TESTER. Both of you must have videoed him for his rivals…….for a small fee of peanuts & foreign chinese prostitutes”. Surely! you can do much better….as your Tok Gurus have so much experience & expertise in fixology & trumpology, sodomology and recently, bluffalogy.

    Chaptokam & Loo Seow Pek, as you both are only about to switch on your “tau geh” brains, if any, carry on ACT FIRST THINK LATER! You Bloody Fools!

    Last laugh with us, rational malaysians….hahahahahahahaha!!!!!

    Ravindran Kunjan

    Ravindran Kunjan

  251. Ravindran Kunjan says:

    Dear All,

    These two sold souls to the flip flop C4 devils, Chaptokam & LooSeowPek, work to the precision of SOP(standard operating procedures) of biro tatanegara school of thought in vulgarity, pornography & sexual scandals/insinuations/mocks/simulations.

    They are both trained by
    1)C4 Najis The Eraser( policy: do not leave any trace: screw & blow up evdience);
    2) drunken cigar smoking ex minister who loves to screw,hug & pinch waitresses;
    3) their ANCESTOR Chua Sway Lok( ex Health Minister employed by VIAGRA Company as a highly paid professional TESTER OF VIAGRA);
    4) MB Pahang who greets everybody with the HAND SIGN of BOLEHLAND (meaning welcome to screwland or you’ll be screwed);
    5) ex minister who immediately after wife succumbs to cancer, marries ex TV3 news girl mistress who had lived in multi million dollar condo provided by this sugar daddy; the list goes on….

    I am sure most of the commentors will agree as what Voltaire said:” I do not have to agree to what you have to say, but I’ll defend to death your right to say it.” Constructive criticisms with decorum observed will always be reciprocated with good comments and progressive discussion.

    But this two rascals CHAPTOKAM & LOO SEOW PEK NUTTY SPIN DOCTORS of PORNO, VULGARITY, SEXUAL INSINUATIONS & SCANDALOUS, VEXATIOUS, MALICIOUS REMARKS are graduates from Biro Tatanegara school of thought on fixology,trumpology, sodomology, dvd sexology, and recently, BLUFFALOGY.

    Cheap but presumed by them( Chaptokam & LooSeowPek) to be amusing….only to their tiny taugeh brains, if any,…..which reflects on their immaturity, immorality, intolerance, rascist & religious fanatics.

    Come on guys…you can do much better as you are trained by the best bolehland PHD holders in murder, sexology, trumpology,sodomology,dvdology, pinchbacksideology,badsignology…

    Try harder! Try extra harder! get to it….switch on your taugeh pee brains…
    and disgrace yourselves.

    Last laugh always with gentlemen & ladies with decorum, rational, disciplined & respectful. Hahahahahahahahahaha!!!!

    Ravindran Kunjan

  252. […] PAS Youth chief Salahuddin Ayub did not ask for the Bar Council (Conversion to Islam) Forum organisers to be ISA-ed. He denied so in Malaysiakini. He said he was not in favour of anyone being […]

  253. loo seow pek says:

    Oi pandi ravindranachi cuntjanachi menachi , poorah vuluk na vuluk

    Ravindran Kunjanachi Minachi thi mah roj apni mori bachdhiya kanjri dha kam karthi
    Ravindran Kunjanachi Minachi maira nandri kattan nahin poondah mona.

    quoet from starsky and hutch “The nation rots to this state because of one Indian.”
    tau ke siape ni olang ??? “The nation rots to this state because of one Indian pandi ravindranachi cuntjanachi menachi.”

  254. Ravindran Kunjanachi Minachi says:

    What? loo seow pek & chaptokam love me? They have to fight first and may the better one win.

  255. Ravindran Kunjanachi Minachi says:

    When Lord made man, the body parts get together and argued;

    “Who will be the boss of the body?”

    The stomach countered, “Since I digested the food, I must be the boss.”

    The brain said, “Since I am controlling the body parts, I must be the boss.”

    The eyes explained, “Since I can see the environment I must be the boss.”

    The legs countered, “Since I take the body to whereever it needs, I must be the boss.”

    Then the arsehole added, “Since I let the body feel good by taking out everything not needed, I must be the boss.

    The body parts laughed and laughed at the arsehole. The arsehole got
    crazy and shut up;

    Three days later the body parts began to get sick since the arsehole hadn’t
    let anything out. The brain got foggy, the legs wobbled, the eyes got crossed’
    the stomach got sick. Then the body parts get together and agreed to make the arsehole boss!

  256. loo seow pek says:

    Aiyoyoy Oi pandi ravindranachi cuntjanachi menachi (00:16:42) :!
    PHd in murder, sexology, trumpology,sodomology,dvdology, pinchbacksideology,badsignology…

    wa lau ni pandi Phd manyak ke ! mesti le . semua dari University Makapodah dari Sodomland dekat Ceriya Pochi.

    Chaptokam & LooSeowPek, work to the precision of SOP alamak dei pandi lu tau ke ape ni SOP ! SOP ia ni Screw Oi Pandi le . Ne ni bontot pandi mesi gosok berseh , tau ke ! balu boleh liwat , kalau tak de nati boss kau pengsan .

    LOL ni Kunjan ape nama oi ia KUN untuk Kunzir JAN untuk Jantan
    Sambong KUN sam JAN ade KUNJAN , Sambong Kunzir sama Jantan ade
    Kunzir Jantan . Sambong menachi adoi wa pun tak tau nak panggil jadi kunzir jantan menachi .

    Di kamunting , bila nak tengok ni pandi berasmara dan liwat senang saja dia ini beli viagra dari ancestor dia CHUA Sway Lok, . Kasi itu pandi makan , mengikut kita puya pandi expert , professor ravindranachi cuntjanachi menachi . Dan relax , tengok wayang pundak oi pandi meliwat . Shiok ini prof cakap . Sampai hali ini dia sudah jadi harimau , ya tiap , tiap hari mau wa itu viagra manyak bagus , satu kali makan , tiap tiap hari mau , bukan meow meow . ini cerita sudah panjang , simpan lain untuk lain hari cerita .

  257. loo seow pek says:

    Ravindran Kunjanachi Minachi (17:10:47) :

    Hello kawan lama , baru satu minngu , lagi ingat menachi , oi tak bloeh tidor lah , tak boleh makan .Tak pe bila senang , wa beli candle light dineer ok !!

  258. Ravindran Kunjanachi Minachi says:

    Loo loves my a**e to be his boss. kekeke

  259. mikewang says:

    DSAI has spoken on this issue.

    I am proud and happy that he has been consistent, in his ceramahs and in real life.
    Right is right and wrong is wrong.
    If we have to appease to scumbags to win their votes, we might as well give up our political convictions.
    So help us God.

    Hidup hidup ! Anwar Anwar !

  260. freewave says:

    Matured malaysian should be open for discussion despite it’s about religion. The Bar Council is right this time. Pkr’s lawyers was kicked out of the meeting, in return, a demo was formed to disrupt the forum from a fair discussion about the rights of non-muslims. PKR is overly sensitive and was trying to politicise the lawyers’ profesionalism. Sorry, right is right and wrong is wrong. I’m indeed very disappointed with some commentators who got the facts the other way round. Politicians are all the same, doesn’t matter they are from the opposition or government, they always get their own personal emotions involved.

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